Discussion:
US Gun Lobby Refuses To Stand Up For Iraqi Gun Rights
(too old to reply)
The Gunner
2007-02-10 14:54:48 UTC
Permalink
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.

Why does the American gun lobby refuse to support the God given right to keep
and bear arms by the peace loving people of Iraq?

Crime is soaring in Iraq. If the citizens were allowed to own guns, it would
be like here in the USA. Crime would vanish.
Herb Martin
2007-02-10 15:46:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Why does the American gun lobby refuse to support the God given right to keep
and bear arms by the peace loving people of Iraq?
Crime is soaring in Iraq. If the citizens were allowed to own guns, it would
be like here in the USA. Crime would vanish.
Last I heard the Iraqis CAN own personal arms, just not anti-tank or
anti-aircraft etc weapons.

Many people here have argued for the Iraqis PUTTING the RKBA into
their Constitution so your assumptions were entirely false.
Hormone
2007-02-10 15:53:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Herb Martin
Last I heard the Iraqis CAN own personal arms, just not anti-tank or
anti-aircraft etc weapons.
Just like Americans, which means they're not truly free.
RD (The Sandman)
2007-02-10 17:36:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hormone
Post by Herb Martin
Last I heard the Iraqis CAN own personal arms, just not anti-tank or
anti-aircraft etc weapons.
Just like Americans, which means they're not truly free.
And you from? Do you think you are truly free?

Wanno bet you don't give an honest answer to either question?
--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)
http://home.comcast.net/~rdsandman

"Tis far better to burn the flag while wrapped in the Constitution than
to burn the Constitution while wrapped in the flag."

".357Mag...my personal version of Homeland Security"

"We'll fill landfills with tons and tons of garbage, but when our trash
is shaped like a human, we [somehow] feel the need to keep it around."
John P...2006
Myal
2007-02-10 22:52:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Hormone
Post by Herb Martin
Last I heard the Iraqis CAN own personal arms, just not anti-tank or
anti-aircraft etc weapons.
Just like Americans, which means they're not truly free.
And you from? Do you think you are truly free?
If you live under rule of govt and are having tax extorted from you
under threat of punishment , youre not free .
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Wanno bet you don't give an honest answer to either question?
"" <Not PC>
2007-02-11 00:40:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
If you live under rule of govt and are having tax extorted from you
under threat of punishment , youre not free .
Well, since EVERY GOVERNMENT in the WORLD with the possible exception
of Somalia and Haiti collect taxes, I guess you are e-mailing us from
ANOTHER DIMENSION.
Myal
2007-02-11 00:44:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by "" <Not PC>
Post by Myal
If you live under rule of govt and are having tax extorted from you
under threat of punishment , youre not free .
Well, since EVERY GOVERNMENT in the WORLD with the possible exception
of Somalia and Haiti collect taxes, I guess you are e-mailing us from
ANOTHER DIMENSION.
why do you say this ?
RD (The Sandman)
2007-02-11 16:49:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Hormone
Post by Herb Martin
Last I heard the Iraqis CAN own personal arms, just not anti-tank or
anti-aircraft etc weapons.
Just like Americans, which means they're not truly free.
And you from? Do you think you are truly free?
If you live under rule of govt and are having tax extorted from you
under threat of punishment , youre not free .
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should have all
the things you want from government for free and not have to pay for it,
you are correct.
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Wanno bet you don't give an honest answer to either question?
--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)
http://home.comcast.net/~rdsandman

"Tis far better to burn the flag while wrapped in the Constitution than
to burn the Constitution while wrapped in the flag."

".357Mag...my personal version of Homeland Security"

"We'll fill landfills with tons and tons of garbage, but when our trash
is shaped like a human, we [somehow] feel the need to keep it around."
John P...2006
Myal
2007-02-11 20:47:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Hormone
Post by Herb Martin
Last I heard the Iraqis CAN own personal arms, just not anti-tank or
anti-aircraft etc weapons.
Just like Americans, which means they're not truly free.
And you from? Do you think you are truly free?
If you live under rule of govt and are having tax extorted from you
under threat of punishment , youre not free .
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should have all
the things you want from government for free and not have to pay for it,
you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter

its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .

For some , to be allowed to own , and in certain restricted
circumstances , use , a gun , this is their definition of "freedom"

in reality though , it is a bickering over shades of shit

most countries have a government extorting taxes under threat of
punishment ,
most countries have a set of laws and regulations that are also enforced
under threat of punishment

that the civillians live under threat of punishment either by fine ,
confiscation of goods or incarceration nearly all over the world , the
US included , proves that virtualy no-one is truly "free"

I really do find the enthusiasm that some have in differentiating over
their shade of shit vs that of others to be realy amusing .

My apoligies to all whom it means a great deal of national pride that
they are allowed to own and in certain circumstances use , a gun , and
truly and honestly believe that this alone makes them a superiour being
......

But Im laughing my arse off at you all right now for your small minded
blinkered view of the world
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Wanno bet you don't give an honest answer to either question?
Herb Martin
2007-02-11 21:24:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should have all
the things you want from government for free and not have to pay for it,
you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
Myal
2007-02-11 21:51:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should have all
the things you want from government for free and not have to pay for it,
you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
Scout
2007-02-11 22:11:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should have
all the things you want from government for free and not have to pay for
it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of total
anarchy?
Myal
2007-02-11 22:57:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should have
all the things you want from government for free and not have to pay for
it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of total
anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure individual aspects
of legislation regulation etc as a measure of the "freedom" you are so
graciously allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ? how petty do
you wish to get ?

you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
Scout
2007-02-11 23:30:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should have
all the things you want from government for free and not have to pay
for it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of total
anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure individual aspects of
legislation regulation etc as a measure of the "freedom" you are so
graciously allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ? how petty do you
wish to get ?
you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
IOW, anarchy or not.

Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable over the
perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want to anyone at
anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability and will to do so.
Herb Martin
2007-02-11 23:50:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable over
the perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want to
anyone at anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability and will
to do so.
And actually in such societs (or close approximations even) no one except
the
strongest has ANY rights -- since everyone else can do anything to you for
any, or no, reason at any time.

The only rights available are those secured by force of arms.

Now an interesting thing about this is that (in a related sub-thread) the
request
by someone for a showing of "god given rights" is pretty much moot -- since
ALL rights have been secured by armed free people willing to stop abuse by
others and by governments.

God-given rights may be an interesting philosophical or religious IDEA, but
the
naked truth is that all rights are secured by armed citizens.

This has always been the case, and likely always will be the case. Unless
human
nature changes in the far distant future.
Scout
2007-02-11 23:57:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Scout
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable over
the perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want to
anyone at anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability and will
to do so.
And actually in such societs (or close approximations even) no one except
the
strongest has ANY rights -- since everyone else can do anything to you for
any, or no, reason at any time.
The only rights available are those secured by force of arms.
Absolutely. Which is one very good reason to insure that government has no
monopoly on force of arms.
Post by Herb Martin
Now an interesting thing about this is that (in a related sub-thread) the
request
by someone for a showing of "god given rights" is pretty much moot -- since
ALL rights have been secured by armed free people willing to stop abuse by
others and by governments.
God-given rights may be an interesting philosophical or religious IDEA,
but the
naked truth is that all rights are secured by armed citizens.
Yep, which is why we organize governments. So that we can collectively
defend our rights since as a group we can better protect our rights than as
individuals. However, by establishing government we give up some of our
rights, such as the right to bash in someone's head because we don't like
him. As such for Myal the only freedom that exists is that of the tooth and
claw existence of absolute anarchy.

Further given his self acknowledgement of his lack of freedom by his
standards, and the fact he still remains in a society that doesn't allow him
this freedom, we can only establish that by his own standards he is a self
determined slave and freely accepts this condition since he refuses to seek
out his freedom.
Myal
2007-02-12 00:51:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should have
all the things you want from government for free and not have to pay
for it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of total
anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure individual aspects of
legislation regulation etc as a measure of the "freedom" you are so
graciously allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ? how petty do you
wish to get ?
you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable over the
perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want to anyone at
anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability and will to do so.
Unfortunately for me ??
Scout
2007-02-12 00:54:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should
have all the things you want from government for free and not have
to pay for it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of total
anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure individual aspects
of legislation regulation etc as a measure of the "freedom" you are so
graciously allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ? how petty do you
wish to get ?
you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable over
the perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want to
anyone at anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability and will
to do so.
Unfortunately for me ??
Yep, since you live in the society established by the rest of us that
includes a government to oppress your freedom to do anything and everything
you want without having to answer to anyone for those acts.
Myal
2007-02-12 03:38:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should
have all the things you want from government for free and not have
to pay for it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of total
anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure individual aspects
of legislation regulation etc as a measure of the "freedom" you are so
graciously allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ? how petty do you
wish to get ?
you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable over
the perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want to
anyone at anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability and will
to do so.
Unfortunately for me ??
Yep, since you live in the society established by the rest of us that
includes a government to oppress your freedom to do anything and everything
you want without having to answer to anyone for those acts.
where did I say I wanted anarchy ? cites please .
Scout
2007-02-12 10:18:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should
have all the things you want from government for free and not have
to pay for it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of total
anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure individual aspects
of legislation regulation etc as a measure of the "freedom" you are so
graciously allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ? how petty do
you wish to get ?
you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable over
the perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want to
anyone at anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability and
will to do so.
Unfortunately for me ??
Yep, since you live in the society established by the rest of us that
includes a government to oppress your freedom to do anything and
everything you want without having to answer to anyone for those acts.
where did I say I wanted anarchy ? cites please .
So you don't want to be free?

Your acceptance of your lack of freedom is noted.
Myal
2007-02-12 11:06:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should
have all the things you want from government for free and not have
to pay for it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of total
anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure individual aspects
of legislation regulation etc as a measure of the "freedom" you are so
graciously allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ? how petty do
you wish to get ?
you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable over
the perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want to
anyone at anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability and
will to do so.
Unfortunately for me ??
Yep, since you live in the society established by the rest of us that
includes a government to oppress your freedom to do anything and
everything you want without having to answer to anyone for those acts.
where did I say I wanted anarchy ? cites please .
So you don't want to be free?
Your acceptance of your lack of freedom is noted.
you totaly failed to answer the question , please feel free to try again
proffsl
2007-02-12 16:38:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel
that you should have all the things you want
from government for free and not have
to pay for it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal /
national definition of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT
is dependent on that definition.
You are wrong you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the
"freedom" of total anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure
individual aspects of legislation regulation etc as a
measure of the "freedom" you are so graciously
allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ?
how petty do you wish to get ?
you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to
be preferable over the perfect freedom of anarchy where
you can do anything you want to anyone at anytime
for any reason as long as you have the ability and
will to do so.
Unfortunately for me ??
Yep, since you live in the society established by the rest
of us that includes a government to oppress your freedom
to do anything and everything you want without having to
answer to anyone for those acts.
where did I say I wanted anarchy ? cites please .
So you don't want to be free?
Your acceptance of your lack of freedom is noted.
you totaly failed to answer the question , please feel free to try
again.
Myal, it seems to me that you are arguing that freedom is only
obtained within anarchy. It seems to me that you are arguing that
unless you can assalt, rob, rape and murder, you aren't truly free.

True Freedom is to be free from assalt, robery, rape and murder. True
Freedom is to be free from the obstruction or the denial of the
exercise of your Rights.

Freedom IS NOT being free TO assalt, rob, rape and murder.

Freedom IS being free FROM assalt, robery, rape and murder.
Scout
2007-02-12 23:02:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should
have all the things you want from government for free and not
have to pay for it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition
of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of
total anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure individual
aspects of legislation regulation etc as a measure of the "freedom"
you are so graciously allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ?
how petty do you wish to get ?
you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable
over the perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want
to anyone at anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability
and will to do so.
Unfortunately for me ??
Yep, since you live in the society established by the rest of us that
includes a government to oppress your freedom to do anything and
everything you want without having to answer to anyone for those acts.
where did I say I wanted anarchy ? cites please .
So you don't want to be free?
Your acceptance of your lack of freedom is noted.
you totaly failed to answer the question , please feel free to try again
That is what you have if you don't have a government that limits your
rights. Since you feel we shouldn't have such a government, what is left but
anarchy?
Myal
2007-02-13 01:00:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Depends on your definition of free. If you feel that you should
have all the things you want from government for free and not
have to pay for it, you are correct.
Now we are getting to the crux of the matter
its totaly dependant on ones own personal / national definition
of "free" .
No "it" isn't dependent on that -- your ARGUMENT is dependent on that
definition.
You are wrong
you are either free , or you are not .
If you are required to obey your govt
you are not free
I see....so the only "freedom" you recognize is the "freedom" of
total anarchy?
you prefer to bicker over shades of shit and measure individual
aspects of legislation regulation etc as a measure of the "freedom"
you are so graciously allowed to keep for the moment by your govt ?
how petty do you wish to get ?
you are either free , or you are not , its that simple
IOW, anarchy or not.
Unfortunately for you most people find government to be preferable
over the perfect freedom of anarchy where you can do anything you want
to anyone at anytime for any reason as long as you have the ability
and will to do so.
Unfortunately for me ??
Yep, since you live in the society established by the rest of us that
includes a government to oppress your freedom to do anything and
everything you want without having to answer to anyone for those acts.
where did I say I wanted anarchy ? cites please .
So you don't want to be free?
Your acceptance of your lack of freedom is noted.
you totaly failed to answer the question , please feel free to try again
That is what you have if you don't have a government that limits your
rights. Since you feel we shouldn't have such a government, what is left but
anarchy?
you totally failed to answer the question , please feel free to try again

or is it difficult justifying your ass-umptions ?
RD (The Sandman)
2007-02-12 17:29:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
My apoligies to all whom it means a great deal of national pride that
they are allowed to own and in certain circumstances use , a gun , and
truly and honestly believe that this alone makes them a superiour
being ......
But Im laughing my arse off at you all right now for your small minded
blinkered view of the world
Laugh all you wish, but all you will show is your ignorance. You have no
idea what my view of the world is.
--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)
http://home.comcast.net/~rdsandman

"Tis far better to burn the flag while wrapped in the Constitution than
to burn the Constitution while wrapped in the flag."

".357Mag...my personal version of Homeland Security"

"We'll fill landfills with tons and tons of garbage, but when our trash
is shaped like a human, we [somehow] feel the need to keep it around."
John P...2006
Gonzo
2007-02-11 02:16:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Hormone
Post by Herb Martin
Last I heard the Iraqis CAN own personal arms, just not anti-tank or
anti-aircraft etc weapons.
Just like Americans, which means they're not truly free.
And you from? Do you think you are truly free?
Wanno bet you don't give an honest answer to either question?
I think THAT is the point he is trying to make Sandman. You are reading too
much into his statement.

That WE are NOT truly free.

And he is 100% correct in that regard.
RD (The Sandman)
2007-02-11 16:52:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gonzo
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Hormone
Post by Herb Martin
Last I heard the Iraqis CAN own personal arms, just not anti-tank
or anti-aircraft etc weapons.
Just like Americans, which means they're not truly free.
And you from? Do you think you are truly free?
Wanno bet you don't give an honest answer to either question?
I think THAT is the point he is trying to make Sandman. You are
reading too much into his statement.
That WE are NOT truly free.
No one is. Not in any country in the world. Everybody has some
interference of some kind from government. It is part and parcel of
being governed. What we can do is make not only the best of it but also
control the government itself....which we do with a vote.

We do not have the form of government that is absolutely the best for
everyone involved. We do, however, have the best government on the
planet.
Post by Gonzo
And he is 100% correct in that regard.
--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)
http://home.comcast.net/~rdsandman

"Tis far better to burn the flag while wrapped in the Constitution than
to burn the Constitution while wrapped in the flag."

".357Mag...my personal version of Homeland Security"

"We'll fill landfills with tons and tons of garbage, but when our trash
is shaped like a human, we [somehow] feel the need to keep it around."
John P...2006
RD (The Sandman)
2007-02-10 17:35:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Why does the American gun lobby refuse to support the God given right
to keep and bear arms by the peace loving people of Iraq?
Crime is soaring in Iraq. If the citizens were allowed to own guns,
it would be like here in the USA. Crime would vanish.
Excuse me, but Iraqi households are authorized to have an AK in their
home. Since it is full auto, I would like to have one here.
--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)
http://home.comcast.net/~rdsandman

"Tis far better to burn the flag while wrapped in the Constitution than
to burn the Constitution while wrapped in the flag."

".357Mag...my personal version of Homeland Security"

"We'll fill landfills with tons and tons of garbage, but when our trash
is shaped like a human, we [somehow] feel the need to keep it around."
John P...2006
Gonzo
2007-02-11 02:19:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Why does the American gun lobby refuse to support the God given right
to keep and bear arms by the peace loving people of Iraq?
Crime is soaring in Iraq. If the citizens were allowed to own guns,
it would be like here in the USA. Crime would vanish.
Excuse me, but Iraqi households are authorized to have an AK in their
home. Since it is full auto, I would like to have one here.
ditto. And the 2nd was supposed to protect our rights to have the same arms
as our Soldiers.

But hell, even in America our own Govt doesn't trust their own soldiers with
weapons. They do not take them home as in Switzerland etc.

Our Govt to our Soldiers: You can use a FA to do our bidding and go in
harms way but we will be God Dammed if you think we will let you own one
when you come home from War!

The Irony is so thick, it stinks up the air.
Jim Bianchi
2007-02-10 19:01:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Why does the American gun lobby refuse to support the God given right to
keep and bear arms by the peace loving people of Iraq?
Crime is soaring in Iraq. If the citizens were allowed to own guns, it
would be like here in the USA. Crime would vanish.
What gungrabbers seem to (deliberately?) confuse is that the origin
of the firearms used in these countries is other countries and insurgent
groups that wish to influence the politics therein. And the arms supplied by
the governments of the US, England, France, China, and the old USSR exceed
in number and value by many orders of magnitude those supplied by arms
dealers. Furthermore, these events, by definition, cannot be affected in the
slightest way by any civilian guncontrol legislation in the US.
--
***@sonic.net

"There are only 10 kinds of people in the world;
those who understand binary, and those who don't."
The Rifleman
2007-02-10 19:37:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god has
nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine countinence comes
from hell not heaven.
Myal
2007-02-10 22:50:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god has
nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine countinence comes
from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
Herb Martin
2007-02-10 23:08:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god
has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong , guns
make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size , all
manner of ego problems.....
Does that really work for you?

Are you speaking from personal knowledge?

Most of us have never understood people who feel the way you
do about your gun and other equipment.
Myal
2007-02-11 00:37:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Herb Martin
Post by The Rifleman
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god
has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong , guns
make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size , all
manner of ego problems.....
Does that really work for you?
Ive seen it in action on this ng more than once .
Post by Herb Martin
Are you speaking from personal knowledge?
From observing the general US-ite on MS spouting of shite about their
right to guns compared to the rest of the world .
Post by Herb Martin
Most of us have never understood people who feel the way you
do about your gun and other equipment.
My gun is safely locked away in a regulation gunsafe .

FWIW , I dont have problems of small stature , etc , and personaly found
that besides making me a lazy hunter , guns didnt do anything for me

I suppose that if I was a shortarse who felt bad about having ducks
disase , or someone inadaquately endowed who had major insecurities
because of this , or if I had some other emotional problem ... yeah , a
gun would be a great crutch .

Or if I lived in a place so violent as the US where a gun is needed to
ensure ones own protection just walking down the street , that would be
understandable too , it would be needed to feel just secure enough to go
out .
Gonzo
2007-02-11 02:33:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god
has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
Does that really work for you?
Ive seen it in action on this ng more than once .
Post by Herb Martin
Are you speaking from personal knowledge?
From observing the general US-ite on MS spouting of shite about their
right to guns compared to the rest of the world .
And your point is? Do you have a Constitition to protect?
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Most of us have never understood people who feel the way you
do about your gun and other equipment.
My gun is safely locked away in a regulation gunsafe .
And so are your testicles I am willing to bet. My guess is you are European
or Australian. Am I far off?

It's the typical ill informed Anti-American anti Gun person that thinks the
2nd Amendment is about "hunting". You are so far off base you are not even
worthy of a response.

And you people continually spout the "The U.S. is so violet" bullshit. You
have never lived here so AFAIAC you are talking out of your ass.

You are (simply put) too brainwashed, indoctrinated, castrated and
liberalized (etc) to understand and comprehend the reasoning behind our Bill
Of Rights.

And even if you could understand and appreciated them for what they are,
you are too far gone to matter it seems.
Myal
2007-02-11 03:54:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gonzo
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god
has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
Does that really work for you?
Ive seen it in action on this ng more than once .
Post by Herb Martin
Are you speaking from personal knowledge?
From observing the general US-ite on MS spouting of shite about their
right to guns compared to the rest of the world .
And your point is? Do you have a Constitition to protect?
lol ... as if I give a toss about politics .
Post by Gonzo
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Most of us have never understood people who feel the way you
do about your gun and other equipment.
My gun is safely locked away in a regulation gunsafe .
And so are your testicles I am willing to bet. My guess is you are European
or Australian. Am I far off?
Aboriginal , actualy since I havent got a ute to cart my gun in anymore
I leave it at a mates place for safe keeping .
Post by Gonzo
It's the typical ill informed Anti-American anti Gun person that thinks the
2nd Amendment is about "hunting". You are so far off base you are not even
worthy of a response.
Personaly , I dont get off on kiling folk YMMV
Post by Gonzo
And you people continually spout the "The U.S. is so violet" bullshit. You
have never lived here so AFAIAC you are talking out of your ass.
I read the continual drivel that oozes therefrom about needing ccw for
protection

why would it be needed ..... if there wasnt a need for it ?
Post by Gonzo
You are (simply put) too brainwashed, indoctrinated, castrated and
liberalized (etc) to understand and comprehend the reasoning behind our Bill
Of Rights.
I simply dont give a shit about your bill of rights , and find it
laughable the way you guys wave it around as if it means something .
Post by Gonzo
And even if you could understand and appreciated them for what they are,
you are too far gone to matter it seems.
Hell yeah , I gave up believing in politicians and their bullshit long ago

I take it you believe in santa claus , tooth fairy and easter bunny
still as well ?
Gonzo
2007-02-12 22:08:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Gonzo
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
Does that really work for you?
Ive seen it in action on this ng more than once .
Post by Herb Martin
Are you speaking from personal knowledge?
From observing the general US-ite on MS spouting of shite about their
right to guns compared to the rest of the world .
And your point is? Do you have a Constitition to protect?
lol ... as if I give a toss about politics .
Post by Gonzo
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Most of us have never understood people who feel the way you
do about your gun and other equipment.
My gun is safely locked away in a regulation gunsafe .
And so are your testicles I am willing to bet. My guess is you are
European or Australian. Am I far off?
Aboriginal , actualy since I havent got a ute to cart my gun in anymore I
leave it at a mates place for safe keeping .
Post by Gonzo
It's the typical ill informed Anti-American anti Gun person that thinks
the 2nd Amendment is about "hunting". You are so far off base you are
not even worthy of a response.
Personaly , I dont get off on kiling folk YMMV
Post by Gonzo
And you people continually spout the "The U.S. is so violet" bullshit.
You have never lived here so AFAIAC you are talking out of your ass.
I read the continual drivel that oozes therefrom about needing ccw for
protection
why would it be needed ..... if there wasnt a need for it ?
Post by Gonzo
You are (simply put) too brainwashed, indoctrinated, castrated and
liberalized (etc) to understand and comprehend the reasoning behind our
Bill Of Rights.
I simply dont give a shit about your bill of rights , and find it
laughable the way you guys wave it around as if it means something .
Post by Gonzo
And even if you could understand and appreciated them for what they are,
you are too far gone to matter it seems.
Hell yeah , I gave up believing in politicians and their bullshit long ago
I take it you believe in santa claus , tooth fairy and easter bunny still
as well ?
You still don't get it and probably never will.

How can I sum this up for you.

Somebody asked Ted Nuggent why he needed all his guns and his reply was "I
don't!".

Now if it needs to be explained to you over and over why Americans have the
right to own guns and why they respect and cherish gun ownership then you
are beyond help and have been thoroughly brainwashed by your respective
liberal controlled media.

With that said, if you want to have a say in how we do things down here,
fill out your visa application and wait.
Myal
2007-02-13 00:53:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gonzo
Now if it needs to be explained to you over and over why Americans have the
right to own guns and why they respect and cherish gun ownership then you
are beyond help and have been thoroughly brainwashed by your respective
liberal controlled media.
Amazing

I was thinking you were brainwashed into believing your GOD give right
to guns made you a free people
Post by Gonzo
With that said, if you want to have a say in how we do things down here,
fill out your visa application and wait.
Herb Martin
2007-02-11 03:44:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god
has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
Does that really work for you?
Ive seen it in action on this ng more than once .
You have seen your weapons compensate for your lack of
equipment or you have been monitoring someone else's
equipment?
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Are you speaking from personal knowledge?
From observing the general US-ite on MS spouting of shite about their
right to guns compared to the rest of the world .
Ah, TRANSLATION: You made that up, or projected it probably
from your own psyche.
Myal
2007-02-11 04:35:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god
has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
Does that really work for you?
Ive seen it in action on this ng more than once .
You have seen your weapons compensate for your lack of
equipment or you have been monitoring someone else's
equipment?
Post by Myal
Post by Herb Martin
Are you speaking from personal knowledge?
From observing the general US-ite on MS spouting of shite about their
right to guns compared to the rest of the world .
Ah, TRANSLATION: You made that up, or projected it probably
from your own psyche.
Looks like I touched a sore point with you hey ??

buy a bigger gun
Gonzo
2007-02-11 02:26:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Herb Martin
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god
has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
Does that really work for you?
Are you speaking from personal knowledge?
Most of us have never understood people who feel the way you
do about your gun and other equipment.
Easy to explain:

"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional
maturity." -Sigmund Freud
Gonzo
2007-02-11 02:24:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god
has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong , guns
make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size , all
manner of ego problems.....
As in our Country when it was young and free and small and weak.

It is well known that when our founding fathers wrote the B.O.Rights, they
wrote it for all mankind. Not just for our own Country.

Im sure there are some good old boys here that will argue that fact but it
is true.

The point that some posters here are trying to make (I think) is that it is
ironic that our Govt is telling the rest of the world how to be free when we
OURSELVES are not free.

Go figure that one out and come back with a logical reason for that.
Too_Many_Tools
2007-02-11 04:16:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
..having voted for Bush TWICE....

TMT
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god has
nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine countinence comes
from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
Myal
2007-02-11 04:37:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Too_Many_Tools
Post by Myal
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
..having voted for Bush TWICE....
TMT
ROTFLMPMP !!!!!!!
Post by Too_Many_Tools
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak, god has
nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine countinence comes
from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size ,
all manner of ego problems.....
RD (The Sandman)
2007-02-11 16:54:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size
, all manner of ego problems.....
Why are all you guys so interested in the size of other folk's dicks?
--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)
http://home.comcast.net/~rdsandman

"Tis far better to burn the flag while wrapped in the Constitution than
to burn the Constitution while wrapped in the flag."

".357Mag...my personal version of Homeland Security"

"We'll fill landfills with tons and tons of garbage, but when our trash
is shaped like a human, we [somehow] feel the need to keep it around."
John P...2006
Myal
2007-02-11 20:54:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size
, all manner of ego problems.....
Why are all you guys so interested in the size of other folk's dicks?
Me ? Im not .

I do notice though that neither you , nor anyone else has objected to
any of the other things guns are regularly used to make up for .

Why is it youre willing to accept having ego problems , ducks disease
and being weak , but cannot handle a comment aimed at the well .....
less than obvious ?
Scout
2007-02-11 21:34:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size
, all manner of ego problems.....
Why are all you guys so interested in the size of other folk's dicks?
Me ? Im not .
I do notice though that neither you , nor anyone else has objected to any
of the other things guns are regularly used to make up for .
Really? What exactly is it you think guns are regularly used to make up for?
Post by Myal
Why is it youre willing to accept having ego problems , ducks disease and
being weak , but cannot handle a comment aimed at the well ..... less than
obvious ?
In short, you are interested and project your inadequacies on others.
Myal
2007-02-11 21:52:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size
, all manner of ego problems.....
Why are all you guys so interested in the size of other folk's dicks?
Me ? Im not .
I do notice though that neither you , nor anyone else has objected to any
of the other things guns are regularly used to make up for .
Really? What exactly is it you think guns are regularly used to make up for?
Reading comprehension truly is not your strong point , is it ?
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Why is it youre willing to accept having ego problems , ducks disease and
being weak , but cannot handle a comment aimed at the well ..... less than
obvious ?
In short, you are interested and project your inadequacies on others.
its really touched a sore point with you hey ? LOL
Scout
2007-02-11 22:13:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size
, all manner of ego problems.....
Why are all you guys so interested in the size of other folk's dicks?
Me ? Im not .
I do notice though that neither you , nor anyone else has objected to any
of the other things guns are regularly used to make up for .
Really? What exactly is it you think guns are regularly used to make up for?
Reading comprehension truly is not your strong point , is it ?
I certainly comprehend you couldn't or wouldn't answer the question.
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Why is it youre willing to accept having ego problems , ducks disease and
being weak , but cannot handle a comment aimed at the well ..... less
than obvious ?
In short, you are interested and project your inadequacies on others.
its really touched a sore point with you hey ? LOL
Just an observation that you claim disinterest and then confess to an
interest. Your hypocrisy should be noted and it's impact upon your
statements understood.
Myal
2007-02-11 23:00:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size
, all manner of ego problems.....
Why are all you guys so interested in the size of other folk's dicks?
Me ? Im not .
I do notice though that neither you , nor anyone else has objected to any
of the other things guns are regularly used to make up for .
Really? What exactly is it you think guns are regularly used to make up for?
Reading comprehension truly is not your strong point , is it ?
I certainly comprehend you couldn't or wouldn't answer the question.
see above
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Why is it youre willing to accept having ego problems , ducks disease and
being weak , but cannot handle a comment aimed at the well ..... less
than obvious ?
In short, you are interested and project your inadequacies on others.
its really touched a sore point with you hey ? LOL
Just an observation that you claim disinterest and then confess to an
interest. Your hypocrisy should be noted and it's impact upon your
statements understood.
its really pissed you off huh ?

tell me , do you actuly own a gun ?
proffsl
2007-02-12 16:49:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Just an observation that you claim disinterest and
then confess to an interest. Your hypocrisy should
be noted and it's impact upon your statements
understood.
its really pissed you off huh ?
Seems to me you are attempting to piss people off, and even in the
face of failure you congratulate yourself.
John-Melb
2007-02-13 05:55:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size
, all manner of ego problems.....
Why are all you guys so interested in the size of other folk's dicks?
Me ? Im not .
I do notice though that neither you , nor anyone else has objected to any
of the other things guns are regularly used to make up for .
Really? What exactly is it you think guns are regularly used to make up for?
Reading comprehension truly is not your strong point , is it ?
Post by Scout
Post by Myal
Why is it youre willing to accept having ego problems , ducks disease and
being weak , but cannot handle a comment aimed at the well ..... less than
obvious ?
In short, you are interested and project your inadequacies on others.
its really touched a sore point with you hey ? LOL- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
You'll have to excuse Myall, he's aboriginal.......- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Interesting reason to excuse someone's inappropriate behaviour.

RD (The Sandman)
2007-02-12 17:30:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size
, all manner of ego problems.....
Why are all you guys so interested in the size of other folk's dicks?
Me ? Im not .
Twould certainly seem so. You are the one who brought it up.
--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)
http://home.comcast.net/~rdsandman

"Tis far better to burn the flag while wrapped in the Constitution than
to burn the Constitution while wrapped in the flag."

".357Mag...my personal version of Homeland Security"

"We'll fill landfills with tons and tons of garbage, but when our trash
is shaped like a human, we [somehow] feel the need to keep it around."
John P...2006
Myal
2007-02-12 21:11:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by RD (The Sandman)
Post by Myal
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
alternatively its a route taken by the weak to dominate the strong ,
guns make up for all kinds of things , small stature , tiny dick size
, all manner of ego problems.....
Why are all you guys so interested in the size of other folk's dicks?
Me ? Im not .
Twould certainly seem so. You are the one who brought it up.
Noted is the *one* thing that got your attention . and your continued
fascination with the subject .

I take it you are a gun owner ?
RD (The Sandman)
2007-02-11 16:53:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
No its not, it is a right taken by the strong to dominate the weak,
god has nothing to do withn it, especially in the US who's divine
countinence comes from hell not heaven.
My right to a firearm comes from neither heaven or hell.
--
Sleep well tonight.........RD (The Sandman)
http://home.comcast.net/~rdsandman

"Tis far better to burn the flag while wrapped in the Constitution than
to burn the Constitution while wrapped in the flag."

".357Mag...my personal version of Homeland Security"

"We'll fill landfills with tons and tons of garbage, but when our trash
is shaped like a human, we [somehow] feel the need to keep it around."
John P...2006
The Rifleman
2007-02-10 19:38:57 UTC
Permalink
American god given right to keep and bear arms, but when you look closer
they prefer it only to apply to white americans, not blacks, hispanics or
anyone politically opposed to the Americans.
Notan
2007-02-10 19:50:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
American god given right to keep and bear arms, but when you look closer
they prefer it only to apply to white americans, not blacks, hispanics or
anyone politically opposed to the Americans.
"not blacks, hispanics or anyone politically opposed to the Americans"

You need to learn the difference between race and nationality.

Among other things.
--
Notan
Gonzo
2007-02-11 02:34:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
American god given right to keep and bear arms, but when you look closer
they prefer it only to apply to white americans, not blacks, hispanics or
anyone politically opposed to the Americans.
Wrong! The Bill Of Rights was written for the entire world.

Whether they have the courage to act on it and defend or take-back their
rights is up to them.
Myal
2007-02-11 03:56:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gonzo
Post by The Rifleman
American god given right to keep and bear arms, but when you look closer
they prefer it only to apply to white americans, not blacks, hispanics or
anyone politically opposed to the Americans.
Wrong! The Bill Of Rights was written for the entire world.
wow

how exceedingly generous of them

I take it they had the whole worlds go-ahead to do that ?

or is this more of the same old same old "the whole world wants to be
american" shite ?
Post by Gonzo
Whether they have the courage to act on it and defend or take-back their
rights is up to them.
Gonzo
2007-02-12 22:02:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Gonzo
Post by The Rifleman
American god given right to keep and bear arms, but when you look closer
they prefer it only to apply to white americans, not blacks, hispanics or
anyone politically opposed to the Americans.
Wrong! The Bill Of Rights was written for the entire world.
wow
how exceedingly generous of them
I take it they had the whole worlds go-ahead to do that ?
or is this more of the same old same old "the whole world wants to be
american" shite ?
Man, are you retarded or what?

It's not about religion, it's about rights.

Yes some of those rights were derived from the Bible, that would be my guess
since our founding fathers were Christians but this is a moot point because
Basic Human Rights like the right to self defense is a universal right in
their eyes and in the eyes of many other religions.

You don't have to believe in God to understand the difference between right
and wrong.

They simply felt the need to reference these rights on something so A Higher
Power made sense in that time period. I guess that would be too hard for
you to comprehend and appreciated since this was well over a hundred years
ago.
Myal
2007-02-13 00:37:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gonzo
Post by Myal
Post by Gonzo
Post by The Rifleman
American god given right to keep and bear arms, but when you look closer
they prefer it only to apply to white americans, not blacks, hispanics or
anyone politically opposed to the Americans.
Wrong! The Bill Of Rights was written for the entire world.
wow
how exceedingly generous of them
I take it they had the whole worlds go-ahead to do that ?
or is this more of the same old same old "the whole world wants to be
american" shite ?
Man, are you retarded or what?
It's not about religion, it's about rights.
LOL!!

please find religion mentioned in my above post ?

who is retarded now ??
Post by Gonzo
Yes some of those rights were derived from the Bible, that would be my guess
since our founding fathers were Christians but this is a moot point because
Basic Human Rights like the right to self defense is a universal right in
their eyes and in the eyes of many other religions.
You don't have to believe in God to understand the difference between right
and wrong.
They simply felt the need to reference these rights on something so A Higher
Power made sense in that time period. I guess that would be too hard for
you to comprehend and appreciated since this was well over a hundred years
ago.
Notan
2007-02-10 19:53:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>

We went through this in a earlier thread.

What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Myal
2007-02-10 22:48:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
haps , he even has to do with your munee , "in god we trust"

the question you realy should be addressing is WHICH god gave that right ?

I know at least on poster who worships Bush
Gonzo
2007-02-11 02:39:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????

Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.

Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?

Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
Lincoln's head. Now fill in the blank:

"In _ _ _ we Trust."

Take your time. We will wait.
Myal
2007-02-11 03:57:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Note

the god is not specified tho

typical freaking political shite

open to all kinds of variables and plenty of weasel room
Gonzo
2007-02-12 21:56:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read
English. Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Note
the god is not specified tho
typical freaking political shite
open to all kinds of variables and plenty of weasel room
Which Deity is not really the issue. Human rights are human rights no
matter what higher power they are base on. Even atheists have human rights.

With that said, our Constitution is based on Christianity like it or not and
our founding fathers were Christians.

New World Order Commie Pinko Liberals may say otherwise but who cares what
they think.

Hell they are trying to outlaw Christmas for Christ's sake!
Notan
2007-02-11 06:35:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.

Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
--
Notan
the heekster
2007-02-11 19:13:54 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:35:38 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Luke 22:36
"Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take
it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell
his garment, and buy one."
Notan
2007-02-11 19:33:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by the heekster
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:35:38 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Luke 22:36
"Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take
it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell
his garment, and buy one."
Nothing is said about *rights*.
--
Notan
the heekster
2007-02-12 01:01:56 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 11 Feb 2007 12:33:54 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by the heekster
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:35:38 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Luke 22:36
"Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take
it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell
his garment, and buy one."
Nothing is said about *rights*.
You didn't ask for rights, you asked for a religious reference where
even a suggestion is made of RKBA.

The suggestion is there. That you lack the intellectual wherewithal
to fathom it, appears to be a personal problem.
Notan
2007-02-12 01:11:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by the heekster
On Sun, 11 Feb 2007 12:33:54 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by the heekster
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:35:38 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Luke 22:36
"Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take
it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell
his garment, and buy one."
Nothing is said about *rights*.
You didn't ask for rights, you asked for a religious reference where
even a suggestion is made of RKBA.
The suggestion is there. That you lack the intellectual wherewithal
to fathom it, appears to be a personal problem.
What do you think the "R" in "RKBA" is?

Sorry, your spin isn't spinning.
--
Notan
the heekster
2007-02-13 03:02:32 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 11 Feb 2007 18:11:29 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by the heekster
On Sun, 11 Feb 2007 12:33:54 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by the heekster
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:35:38 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Luke 22:36
"Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take
it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell
his garment, and buy one."
Nothing is said about *rights*.
You didn't ask for rights, you asked for a religious reference where
even a suggestion is made of RKBA.
The suggestion is there. That you lack the intellectual wherewithal
to fathom it, appears to be a personal problem.
What do you think the "R" in "RKBA" is?
Sorry, your spin isn't spinning.
Point proven.
Myal
2007-02-11 20:57:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by the heekster
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:35:38 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Luke 22:36
"Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take
it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell
his garment, and buy one."
OK , so you have a instruction from a human ( who was killed shortly
thereafter and BTW REFUSED to let his sword carrying buddies use the
same weapons he instructed them to get hold of ) to buy a purse and sword .

this means you have a GOD given right to own guns ?

or does it mean youre suposed to be wearing a handbag and a big knife ?
the heekster
2007-02-12 01:09:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by the heekster
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:35:38 -0700, Notan
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read English.
Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed above
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Luke 22:36
"Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take
it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell
his garment, and buy one."
OK , so you have a instruction from a human ( who was killed shortly
thereafter and BTW REFUSED to let his sword carrying buddies use the
same weapons he instructed them to get hold of ) to buy a purse and sword .
No, I don't. I provided a religious reference with the suggestion of
a RKBA. Try reading for comprehension.
Post by Myal
this means you have a GOD given right to own guns ?
No, ament, it means that a religious reference was provided as
requested.
Post by Myal
or does it mean youre suposed to be wearing a handbag and a big knife ?
I see that the English of the KJV is a bit more than you can handle.
So there is probably no point in providing it to you in the original.

It would be literally, to coin a phrase, Greek, to you.
Gonzo
2007-02-12 21:51:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read
English. Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Show you? Again, have YOU ACTUALLY tried reading the Constitution of the
United States? Or are you just playing dumb to sideskirt the issue?
Notan
2007-02-12 22:11:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read
English. Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Show you? Again, have YOU ACTUALLY tried reading the Constitution of the
United States? Or are you just playing dumb to sideskirt the issue?
"In God We Trust" says <whorever "we" is> believes in God.

Anything "we" say, at that point, can be interpreted as being supported by
God.
--
Notan
Notan
2007-02-12 22:31:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read
English. Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Show you? Again, have YOU ACTUALLY tried reading the Constitution of
the United States? Or are you just playing dumb to sideskirt the issue?
"In God We Trust" says <whorever "we" is> believes in God.
Anything "we" say, at that point, can be interpreted as being supported by
God.
That was supposed to be "<whoever "we" is>," but I'm sure you got the point.
--
Notan
Gonzo
2007-02-12 23:33:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Notan
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read
English. Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Show you? Again, have YOU ACTUALLY tried reading the Constitution of
the United States? Or are you just playing dumb to sideskirt the issue?
"In God We Trust" says <whorever "we" is> believes in God.
Anything "we" say, at that point, can be interpreted as being supported by
God.
That was supposed to be "<whoever "we" is>," but I'm sure you got the point.
--
Notan
You didn't make a point. Do you even understand your own posting?
Gonzo
2007-02-12 23:32:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read
English. Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Show you? Again, have YOU ACTUALLY tried reading the Constitution of the
United States? Or are you just playing dumb to sideskirt the issue?
"In God We Trust" says <whorever "we" is> believes in God.
Anything "we" say, at that point, can be interpreted as being supported by
God.
--
Notan
And you have a problem with this because....?
Notan
2007-02-12 23:46:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by Gonzo
Post by Notan
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
<snip>
We went through this in a earlier thread.
What did God have to do with the Second Amendment?
--
Notan
Um , have you ever actually read the Constitution??????
Let me guess, You are not an American and you have never read the
Constitution right?
That's OK, it's not required reading if you are a foreign national.
Since you are posting here I have to presume you know how to read
English. Correct?
Here is a test for ya...take penny (U.S.) and read what is inscribed
"In _ _ _ we Trust."
Take your time. We will wait.
Nice try.
Show me *any* religious reference where even a suggestion is made of a
"right to keep and bear arms."
Show you? Again, have YOU ACTUALLY tried reading the Constitution of the
United States? Or are you just playing dumb to sideskirt the issue?
"In God We Trust" says <whorever "we" is> believes in God.
Anything "we" say, at that point, can be interpreted as being supported by
God.
--
Notan
And you have a problem with this because....?
I don't have *any* problem with it!

I'm just saying that a lot of what we're discussing isn't cut and dry,
but more a matter of interpretation.

Does *everything* have to be an argument?
--
Notan
Bongo Jim
2007-02-10 20:53:35 UTC
Permalink
Iraqis are allowed one firearm in their household for self defense.
It can be a .45 or a shotgun or an AK.

They aren't allowed an RPG Launcher or a SAM.

The real question is why didn't NOW (National Organization for Women)
have a few protests in Afghanistan about the Talibans treatment of
women? Burka anyone?
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Why does the American gun lobby refuse to support the God given right to keep
and bear arms by the peace loving people of Iraq?
Crime is soaring in Iraq. If the citizens were allowed to own guns, it would
be like here in the USA. Crime would vanish.
Gonzo
2007-02-11 02:45:50 UTC
Permalink
Correct.

And that is because their Constitution is based on OUR current Govt's
twisted interpretation of the 2nd Amendment rather than the original one.

Regardless if it is written in plain easy to understand Early American
English.

You not only have to read the words, You have to take into account it's
intent at the time of it's inception. Which is to have the Militia (that's
you and me folks!) to have the same weapons as any Standing army to keep the
said "standing army " from walking over us.

And our founding fathers were worried about more than just the British.
This is why Americans are SUPPOSED to be armed and have that right. And
this means military weapons folks.

It does not have a Damn thing to do with hunting.
Post by Bongo Jim
Iraqis are allowed one firearm in their household for self defense.
It can be a .45 or a shotgun or an AK.
They aren't allowed an RPG Launcher or a SAM.
The real question is why didn't NOW (National Organization for Women)
have a few protests in Afghanistan about the Talibans treatment of
women? Burka anyone?
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Why does the American gun lobby refuse to support the God given right to keep
and bear arms by the peace loving people of Iraq?
Crime is soaring in Iraq. If the citizens were allowed to own guns, it would
be like here in the USA. Crime would vanish.
e***@netpath.net
2007-02-11 11:10:03 UTC
Permalink
Iraqis are allowed one firearm in their household for self >defense.
It can be a .45 or a shotgun or an AK.
In other words, Washington's ALREADY allowing Iraqis more gun
rights than it allows Americans. Does Washington routinely allow
AMERICANS in AMERICA to routinely own selective-fire AK-47s without
hassle - as it does for Iraqis in Iraq?

No $4 to park! No $6 admission! http://www.INTERNET-GUN-SHOW.com
Myal
2007-02-11 11:13:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by e***@netpath.net
Iraqis are allowed one firearm in their household for self >defense.
It can be a .45 or a shotgun or an AK.
In other words, Washington's ALREADY allowing Iraqis more gun
rights than it allows Americans. Does Washington routinely allow
AMERICANS in AMERICA to routinely own selective-fire AK-47s without
hassle - as it does for Iraqis in Iraq?
No $4 to park! No $6 admission! http://www.INTERNET-GUN-SHOW.com
guns = freedom

America has freed Iraq

operation Iraqi freedom and all that

remember ?

shame about the guys back home tho
proffsl
2007-02-12 20:31:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Actually, the Right to Keep and Bear arms is a Right Endowed by our
Creation as Sentient Beings. While a "God" can not be proven or
disproved, Creation certainly can be objectively proven, and can not
be reasonably denied. If you wish to believe it was a "God" that
Created us, or not, that changes none of the following.

Being Created as a Sentient Being, we are Endowed by Creation with the
Power of Consent. Every Sentient Being has the Power of Consent.
When we give our Consent to something done or proposed, we are
claiming that with our Consent that thing is Right. When we deny our
Consent to something done or proposed, we are claiming that without
our Consent that thing is Wrong. Therefore, by the exercise of our
Power of, the giving or denying of, our Consent, we are witnessing to
the existence of Right and Wrong.

Therefore, claim of Ignorance of Right and Wrong is NO EXCUSE.

There is Rightful Consent, and Wrongful Consent. Rightful Consent may
only be given to that for which one has a Right to. Wrongful Consent
is given to that which one has no Right to. Only I may give another
Rightful Consent to enter my home. Only you may give another Rightful
Consent to enter your home. If I give Consent to another to enter
your home without the Right to do so, I have given them Wrongful
Consent.

To secure Rightful Consent, Creation endows all Sentient Beings with
certain Inherent and Inalienable Rights, among these being the
Inherent Right to Innocence, Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of
Happiness. An Inherent Right may only be to a behavior which the one
can exercise. An Inherent Right may only be to that which only
obligates others to not obstruct or deny the one's exercise thereof.
An Inherent Right may only be to that which does not obligate others
to provide for the one.

Inherent Rights are unchanging, inclusive, and infinite, but not
without bounds. Inherent Rights simply are what they are, much as the
laws of physics are what they are, to be discovered, tested, and then
Enumerated.

Enumerated Rights represent our best guess of what are truly Inherent
Rights, they are therefore neither absolute nor infinite, and are
subject to change as we either better understand what are truly
Inherent Rights, or begin to forget what are truly Inherent Rights.

The Right of Innocence is the Right to do as we please so long as we
do not Violate the Rights of any others. This is a behavior which the
one may exercise, and therefore passes the first part of the test
above. This is a behavior which only obligates others to not obstruct
or deny the one's exercise thereof, and therefore passes the second
part of the test above. And, this is a behavior which does not
obligate others to provide for the one, and therefore passes the third
part of the test above.

The Right of Life is the Right to Live. This is a behavior which the
one may exercise, and therefore passes the first part of the test
above. This is a behavior which the one may exercise, and therefore
passes the first part of the test above. This is a behavior which
only obligates others to not obstruct or deny the one's exercise
thereof, and therefore passes the second part of the test above. And,
this is a behavior which does not obligate others to provide for the
one, and therefore passes the third part of the test above.

The Rights of Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness also pass all the
portions of the test above. And, so does the Right to Keep and Bear
Arms pass all the portions of the test above.

Now, let's wrongly presume that Murder is a Right. Would such a Right
pass the test above? Well, Murder is a behavior which the one may
exercise, so it passes the first part of the test. One might even
argue that Murder only obligates others to not obstruct or deny the
one's exercise thereof. But, Murder does obligate others to provide
for the one, specifically a Life for them to take. Therefore, a
presumed Right to Murder DOES NOT pass all three portions of the test
above, and is therefore not a Right.

Let's also wrongly presume that we have the Right that others NOT Keep
and Bear Arms. Would this presumed Right pass the test above? Right
off the bat, it fails the first portion of the test, in that "others
NOT Keeping or Bearing Arms" IS NOT a behavior which the one
exercises. Although, it might be argued that a Right that "others NOT
Keep or Bear Arms" is a Right that is obstructed or denied when others
do Keep or Bear Arms, this is still not a Right that the one is being
obstructed or denied the exercise thereof as it failed the first
portion of the test. This presumed Right also fails the third part of
the test in that it does indeed obligate others to provide for the
one, specifically that they provide the behavior of not Keeping or
Bearing Arms.

If you believe you can trick the test above, have at it.
Post by The Gunner
Why does the American gun lobby refuse to support
the God given right to keep and bear arms by the peace
loving people of Iraq?
Crime is soaring in Iraq. If the citizens were allowed to
own guns, it would be like here in the USA. Crime
would vanish.
I detect a facetious tone in your words.

The American gun lobby is primarily concerned with the Rights of
American citizens, therefore it's name.

Also, the Right to Keep and Bear Arms does not, as you would try to
suggest, make Crime simply vanish. Instead, it empowers Citizens to
be able to defend themselves against Crime.

I would go so far as to say that Innocent Citizens of Iraq have as
much a Right to defend themselves against Crime as do Americans.
Difficult Listening
2007-02-12 21:15:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by proffsl
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Actually, the Right to Keep and Bear arms is a Right Endowed by our
Creation as Sentient Beings.
I have to agree, only to a point.
After all, only IDIOTS believe in "gods", and also, our 'rights' are
PROTECTED by our Government here in the USA, as they were originally
"given" to us by our natural human instincts.... meaning, we already
have them!


Since "gods" simply can't exist, that Mofo wasn't the shit stain that
"gave" anything.

Give some credit to Human Kind, and all that we DO have already,
before you give it all to some imaginary spook, eh?

What "gods" do Tigers, Sharks, and etc., have to believe in order for
their existence?

Do "kittens-n-puppies" go to heaven?

If you BELIEVE IN "gods".. yer an idiot.
proffsl
2007-02-12 21:50:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Difficult Listening
Post by proffsl
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Actually, the Right to Keep and Bear arms is a Right
Endowed by our Creation as Sentient Beings. While a
"God" can not be proven or disproved, Creation certainly
can be objectively proven, and can not be reasonably
denied. If you wish to believe it was a "God" that
Created us, or not, that changes none of the following.
I have to agree, only to a point.
After all, only IDIOTS believe in "gods", and also, our 'rights'
are PROTECTED by our Government here in the USA, as
they were originally "given" to us by our natural human
instincts.... meaning, we already have them!
This "instinct" you speak of is a quality Endowed by our Creation as
Sentient Beings. If we were not Sentient Beings, Right and Wrong
would be meaningless to us, and therefore there would be no
instinctual knowledge of them. It is our Creation as Sentient Beings
which give us the instinctual (Inherent) knowledge of Right and Wrong.
Post by Difficult Listening
Since "gods" simply can't exist, that Mofo wasn't the
shit stain that "gave" anything.
It can not be proven that there IS a "God". It also can not be proven
that there IS NOT a "God".
Post by Difficult Listening
Give some credit to Human Kind, and all that we DO
have already, before you give it all to some imaginary
spook, eh?
What "gods" do Tigers, Sharks, and etc., have to believe
in order for their existence?
Do "kittens-n-puppies" go to heaven?
If you BELIEVE IN "gods".. yer an idiot.
If you BELIEVE in things of which you have no knowledge, that is
called "faith", and I consider "faith" to be foolish. If you testify
to things of which you have no knowledge, that is called "False
Witness", and I consider "False Witness" to be Wrong.

To believe in a "God" without any knowledge of such, that would be an
exhibition of faith, and in my opinion foolish. To testify to the
existence a "God" without any knowledge, that would be False Witness,
and in my opinion Wrong.

To believe there is NO "God" without any knowledge of such, that would
also be an exhibition of faith, and in my opinion just as foolish. To
testify to the non-existence of a "God" without any knowledge, that
would be False Witness, and in my opinion just as Wrong.

But, this is all neither here nor there in respect to my previous
post.

Let's consider those Kittens you speak of. Are they Sentient Beings?
Possibly they are. In fact, I suspect many animals possess certain
levels of Sentient (self aware)qualities, and therefore possess
certain levels of knowledge of Right and Wrong, and also that they
possess Inherent Rights, endowed by their Creation.

I tried to avoid any debate as to the existence of a "God", and
instead focus on the Origin of Rights as being Inherently Endowed by
our Creation as Sentient Beings. I really would like more discussion
along those lines, and simply avoid this "God" thing.
Don
2007-02-12 22:40:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by proffsl
To believe there is NO "God" without any knowledge of such, that would
also be an exhibition of faith, and in my opinion just as foolish.
Either a thing exists or it doesn't.
Belief has nothing to do with it.
Notan
2007-02-12 22:48:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don
Post by proffsl
To believe there is NO "God" without any knowledge of such, that would
also be an exhibition of faith, and in my opinion just as foolish.
Either a thing exists or it doesn't.
Belief has nothing to do with it.
Does God exist?
--
Notan
proffsl
2007-02-13 01:33:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don
Post by proffsl
To believe there is NO "God" without any knowledge
of such, that would also be an exhibition of faith,
and in my opinion just as foolish.
Either a thing exists or it doesn't.
Belief has nothing to do with it.
Things either exist or they do not. But, to have a Belief that
something does or does not exist without knowledge is foolish.
Scout
2007-02-13 01:38:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by proffsl
Post by Don
Post by proffsl
To believe there is NO "God" without any knowledge
of such, that would also be an exhibition of faith,
and in my opinion just as foolish.
Either a thing exists or it doesn't.
Belief has nothing to do with it.
Things either exist or they do not. But, to have a Belief that
something does or does not exist without knowledge is foolish.
Then everyone that ever had an idea about what could exist and exercised a
belief in that existence by trying to prove it was foolish.

Congratulations, you have just called much of human achievement as being
foolish.
proffsl
2007-02-13 02:19:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scout
Post by proffsl
Post by Don
Post by proffsl
To believe there is NO "God" without any knowledge
of such, that would also be an exhibition of faith,
and in my opinion just as foolish.
Either a thing exists or it doesn't.
Belief has nothing to do with it.
Things either exist or they do not. But, to have a Belief
that something does or does not exist without knowledge
is foolish.
Then everyone that ever had an idea about what could exist
and exercised a belief in that existence by trying to prove it
was foolish.
To have a belief that something could exist IS NOT a belief that it
does exist. To have a belief that something could exist should
solicit actions to either prove it does exist, or to bring it into
existence. To have a belief that something could exist without any
evidence is perfectly acceptable, but to believe that something does
exist without any evidence is foolish.
Post by Scout
Congratulations, you have just called much of human
achievement as being foolish.
I have done nothing of the kind. Human achievement isn't accomplished
merely by believing things exist. Human achievement is accomplished
by first believing things COULD exist, and then taking the efforts to
prove they do exist, or the efforts to bring them into existence.
Myal
2007-02-13 04:26:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by proffsl
Post by Don
Post by proffsl
To believe there is NO "God" without any knowledge
of such, that would also be an exhibition of faith,
and in my opinion just as foolish.
Either a thing exists or it doesn't.
Belief has nothing to do with it.
Things either exist or they do not. But, to have a Belief that
something does or does not exist without knowledge is foolish.
I have scientific text books from the 70s that have as fact the clouds
of cosmic dust that are yet to form into planets

some fool believed there was more to it and invented better telescopes

and foolishly looked beyond what was known and saw the clouds of cosmic
dust about to evolve into planets were actualy other galaxies

stoopid fools
proffsl
2007-02-13 05:31:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Myal
Post by proffsl
Post by Don
Post by proffsl
To believe in a "God" without any knowledge
of such, that would be an exhibition of faith,
and in my opinion foolish.
To believe there is NO "God" without any
knowledge of such, that would also be an
exhibition of faith, and in my opinion just
as foolish.
Either a thing exists or it doesn't.
Belief has nothing to do with it.
Things either exist or they do not. But, to have a
Belief that something does or does not exist
without knowledge is foolish.
I have scientific text books from the 70s that have
as fact the clouds of cosmic dust that are yet to
form into planets
some fool believed there was more to it and
invented better telescopes
and foolishly looked beyond what was known
and saw the clouds of cosmic dust about to
evolve into planets were actualy other galaxies
stoopid fools
The one's who wrote as if fact that the "clouds of cosmic dust" they
saw formed into planets where the fools for portraying as fact
something for which they only had a Belief, without any evidence. The
one's who choose to look beyond what was believed and to build a
better telescope to gain a better understand were not foolish.

Clearly, you are not accurately following what I am saying, because
you are portraying what I am saying in a completely inaccurate way, as
if it were fact. You are making the same foolish mistake those
writers of the 70s did.

To have a belief that something DOES exist IS NOT the same as having a
belief that something COULD exist. As I originally wrote: To have a
belief that something DOES or DOES NOT exist without knowledge or
evidence is foolish. To have a belief that something COULD exist
without knowledge or evidence is perfectly acceptable.

To have a belief that something COULD exist should solicit actions to
either prove it does exist, or to bring it into existence. Those
scientists who had the belief that those "clouds of cosmic dust" COULD
be something else other than dust were prompted to build better
telescopes, and in doing so discovered those "clouds of cosmic dust"
were in fact other galaxies.

Human achievement isn't accomplished merely by believing things DO
exist. Human achievement is accomplished by first believing things
COULD exist, and then taking the efforts to prove they do exist, or
the efforts to bring them into existence.

I hope you do not once again make the foolish mistake of believing
that something DOES exist, that I am saying it is foolish to seek
truth (because I am not), without evidence. The irony just drips from
that.

Belief that something DOES exist without evidence is foolish.

Belief that something COULD exist without evidence IS NOT foolish.
The Lone Weasel
2007-02-12 23:39:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by proffsl
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right given by God.
Actually, the Right to Keep and Bear arms is a Right Endowed by our
Creation as Sentient Beings.
Just keep capitalizing your initial letters, gullible gunloons will be
impressed.

while a "God" can not be proven or
Post by proffsl
disproved, Creation certainly can be objectively proven
Then prove it you quasi-religious quack.
--
Yours truly,

The Lone Weasel
proffsl
2007-02-13 01:43:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Lone Weasel
Post by proffsl
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right
given by God.
Actually, the Right to Keep and Bear arms is a
Right Endowed by our Creation as Sentient Beings.
Just keep capitalizing your initial letters, gullible
gunloons will be impressed.
As though you believe this attack upon my punctuation instead upon the
content of my post makes your response any more impressive?
Post by The Lone Weasel
Post by proffsl
while a "God" can not be proven or disproved,
Creation certainly can be objectively proven
Then prove it you quasi-religious quack.
There was a time when you did not exist, and now is a time that you do
exist. You have a beginning. You were Created (by your parents I
suspect). That moment when your life began was your moment of
Creation. NOTHING QUASI-RELIGIOUS ABOUT IT. Purely Scientific Fact.
It's just too bad you were CREATED as a Personally Insulting Idiot.
The Lone Weasel
2007-02-13 02:59:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by proffsl
Post by The Lone Weasel
Post by proffsl
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right
given by God.
Actually, the Right to Keep and Bear arms is a
Right Endowed by our Creation as Sentient Beings.
Just keep capitalizing your initial letters, gullible
gunloons will be impressed.
As though you believe this attack upon my punctuation instead upon the
content of my post makes your response any more impressive?
Capitalization is not punctuation. You're just trying to sound profound
without using the big words, eh punk?
Post by proffsl
Post by The Lone Weasel
Post by proffsl
while a "God" can not be proven or disproved,
Creation certainly can be objectively proven
Then prove it you quasi-religious quack.
There was a time when you did not exist, and now is a time that you do
exist. You have a beginning. You were Created
You're a creationist aren't you, Dumbass? Stop capitalizing stuff you
don't understand you ridiculous creationist troll.
--
Yours truly,

The Lone Weasel
proffsl
2007-02-13 04:02:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Lone Weasel
Post by proffsl
Post by The Lone Weasel
Post by proffsl
Post by The Gunner
The right to keep and bear arms is a right
given by God.
Actually, the Right to Keep and Bear arms is
a Right Endowed by our Creation as Sentient
Beings.
Just keep capitalizing your initial letters, gullible
gunloons will be impressed.
As though you believe this attack upon my punctuation
instead upon the content of my post makes your
response any more impressive?
Capitalization is not punctuation.
Indeed it is. From Merriam-Webster: punctuation - something that
contrasts or accentuates.
Post by The Lone Weasel
You're just trying to sound profound without using
the big words, eh punk?
Do you believe your choice to be personally insulting instead of
actually addressing the context of my words makes you appear profound?
Post by The Lone Weasel
Post by proffsl
Post by The Lone Weasel
Post by proffsl
while a "God" can not be proven or disproved,
Creation certainly can be objectively proven
Then prove it you quasi-religious quack.
There was a time when you did not exist, and now
is a time that you do exist. You have a beginning.
You were Created
You're a creationist aren't you,
If by Creationist, you mean that I prescribe to "a doctrine or theory
holding that matter, the various forms of life, and the world were
created by God out of nothing", NO, I am not a Creationist in that
sense. As I have stated a number of times now, I simply do not know
if there IS or IS NOT a "God".

I know of is those things that exist in our Universe. And, except for
the Laws of Physics, all those things I know of have both a Beginning
and an End. I also know that everything with a Beginning was Created,
and that it was their Creator that brought about their Creation. As
for the Laws of Physics, I do not know if they had a Beginning or not.

For example, the Mona Lisa is a painting that had a Beginning.
Therefore, the Mona Lisa was Created. Leonardo da Vinci was it's
Creator. Leonardo da Vinci brought about the Creation of the Mona
Lisa.

Another example: Your response here had a Beginning. Therefore, your
response was Created. You are it's Creator. You brought about the
Creation of your response.

Yet another example: The planet Earth had a Beginning. Therefore,
the Earth was Created. The Sun and the Laws of Physics are it's
Creator. The Sun and the Laws of Physics brought about the Creation
of the Earth.
Post by The Lone Weasel
Dumbass?
Rather, your demonstrated tendency to leap to unsupported conclusions
paints you as the Dumbass.
Post by The Lone Weasel
Stop capitalizing stuff
I am not here to take directives from a Dumbass Troll. I will
Capatalize ANYTHING I choose to cApAtAlize.
Post by The Lone Weasel
you don't understand you
ridiculous creationist troll.
I am not a "creationist" in the sense that you suggest, and it is you
who is demonstrating an inability to address the context of what I
actually do say, and instead choose to be a personally insulting and
ridiculous troll.
The Lone Weasel
2007-02-13 04:37:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by proffsl
Post by The Lone Weasel
Capitalization is not punctuation.
Indeed it is.
[begin definitions]

punctuation

3. a. The practice, art, method, or system of inserting points or ‘stops’
to aid the sense, in writing or printing; division of written or printed
matter into sentences, clauses, etc. by means of points or stops. The
ordinary sense. -OED


capitalling

The furnishing of a word with a capital letter.

1683 Moxon Mech. Exerc., Printing 261 The Correcter+examines the Proof, and
considers the Pointing, Italicking, Capitalling, or any error.

[end definitions]

This poster killfiled 180 days for capitalling.

PLONK.
--
Yours truly,

The Lone Weasel
proffsl
2007-02-13 05:38:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Lone Weasel
Post by The Lone Weasel
Capitalization is not punctuation.
punctuation - something that contrasts or accentuates.
This poster killfiled 180 days for capitalling.
PLONK.
Thanks for this small favor. Can you make it for a longer period?
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