Discussion:
Yanks trying to run away again
(too old to reply)
The Rifleman
2007-10-27 10:57:39 UTC
Permalink
Hardy Har Har Har, Those super roughy toughy brave yanks are at it again,
They invade Iraq, Wreck the place but then are to afraid to go there and
clean up the mess they made " Oh dear we cant go there the baddies shoot
back", Meanwhile in Kabul the Brit diplomats have got on with doing the
job and have built themselves a swimming pool and helped the locals open a
golk course, all while the yanks are hiding in their fire bases.
US threat over Iraq embassy staff
The US state department has said it may have to force some diplomats to
work in Iraq to fill vacancies at the embassy in Baghdad.
About 250 foreign service staff are to be told they are "prime candidates"
for nearly 50 jobs, state department human resources director Harry Thomas
said.
If too few people volunteer, some will be ordered to go and risk dismissal
if they refuse, Mr Thomas said.
Iraq postings have previously been filled on a voluntary basis.
Vietnam precedent
Mr Thomas said he hoped enough diplomats would volunteer to fill the
one-year postings but that "we have many options, including dismissal from
the foreign service".
The "prime candidates" will be informed by post on Monday and have 10 days
to reply.
To sweeten the deal, an attractive financial package is being offered as
well as a generous leave allowance.
The Baghdad embassy is considered a hardship posting by US diplomats
because of the security risks and because spouses and children must be
left at home.
American diplomats have been forced to work in undesirable postings
before.
Some were given no choice but to take postings in some African countries
in the 1970s and 1980s and in 1969 an entire class of new foreign service
officers was sent to Vietnam.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/7065019.stm
Published: 2007/10/27 04:21:17 GMT
© BBC MMVII
V
2007-10-29 17:53:20 UTC
Permalink
Hardy Har Har Har, Those super roughy toughy brave yanks are at it again,
They invade Iraq, Wreck the place but then are to afraid to go there
Hey..whats the deal with the YANKS posts?

You got a hard-on for YANKS rifleman?

We are all here to help each other out aren't we?

If that is what you like spending time on then feel free...after all
we still got free speech for the time being. And the atheists call me
much worse things than a Yank.

See:

http://jesusneverexisted.org/jne/forum/index.php?topic=509.0

But name calling does not help a discussion, it only inflames the
participants and becomes a crutch for those that can't argue facts and
must succumb to arguing personalties.

I am no fan of Bush, but at least he keeps the crude flowing, so to
all the Bush haters...leave him alone. He has a thankless and
impossible job.

We will be at war over crude until the last buckets have been sucked
from the earth...so get used to it.

As we would leave the Middle East...China or Russia would step in.

See:

http://www.amazon.com/Resource-Wars-Landscape-Conflict-Introduction/dp/0805055762

You like typing on the 'puter don't you?

Well, without the crude to make the diesel to power the train that
brings the coal to the power plant you would not be typing on the
'puter.

So kiss the asses of the politicians for 2 reasons

1) They are not atheists and they are Christian based

2 They keep the crude flowing the best way they can under somewhat
Christian principles.

You see, if they were atheists they would just try to take the crude
and not pay for it like the Chinese or Russians have done and kill
everything that got in their path.

The Christian based US pays for what they take and stops the killing
unless it is absolutely necessary to keep the crude flowing so we can
live like energy whores.

If the Dem's get in I'm afraid you guys are in for rude awakening.

Really it will be an 'ass reaming' and you wont be able to use any
Vaseline either - since Vaseline is made from crude oil as well.

You see, Hillary wont fight for oil, she will be too busy banning guns
at home.

(BTW, I am not a Dem or Rep and hate all politicians as they are power
hungry, ego based individuals...but who will we get to run things
without them?? And in normal circumstances I think Hillary would make
a decent president and wouldn't mind trying her out...but not when it
comes to crude wars as well as the wars at home that I detail below.)

WAKE UP GUYS!!!!

It seems everyone wishes to hide their heads in the sand when it comes
to this subject of peak oil. We can't depend on the President to come
clean with the public. All his energies are spent just trying to keep
the oil flowing. He can't admit that the oil will stop in the not so
distant future, no matter what we do. It is a problem beyond his as
well as all of our control.

As they say in 12 Step programs - admitting you have a problem is step
1. And our country cannot admit it, after all, admitting this problem
would raise hell with our retirement funds. And until we can admit it,
we cannot begin on our long road to a 'semblance' of recovery.

And in the big picture, we can't fix the problem, we can only postpone
the inevitable. But buying a little more time would make things much
more livable in the not so distant future than the current path we are
headed in.

The world is in a death spiral and politicians as well as industry are
pretending this problem does not exist. We can only blame ourselves,
for it is just how we have built our world over the years....too many
people, living outside of natures intended balance and not an infinite
supply of energy to fuel all our demands.

It would be one thing if we all reverted back to rural living, burning
trees for fuel and housing and living within our comfortable means
allotted to us by nature, as our ancestors did back in the day. But
ten billion people can't burn the trees! (Ten billion people is a
conservative estimate of world population in the not so distant
future. We are at 7 people billion now.)

The World Coal Institute estimates world energy reserves as follows:

"At current production levels coal will be available for at least the
next 155 years compared to 41 years for oil and 65 years for gas."

http://www.worldcoal.org/pages/content/index.asp?PageID=21

Even though this was written a few years ago and it is based on
'current production and consumption' it gives the same haunting
message to the generations to come.

We may not exactly see the end of our free flowing energy as we know
it - but some of our descendants will in the not so distant future.
This is the legacy they will inherit from us. But before the energy
dries up completely massive changes in our world will have taken
place.

Our population has grown to levels where it has passed the point of no
return for supporting a sustainable human population as we know it
today when it comes to their energy demands.

And leading the pack of over consumers is the USA.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/ene_oil_con-energy-oil-consumption

Consumption is ingrained in us and we know no other way. And even if
we wished to amend our ways, how could all our retirement funds take
the hit? America is built on borrowed money, spending and consumerism.

And what does all that consumerism lead to?

It leads to the mess we are in now and the bigger mess the world will
be in once India and China pick up momentum to copycat the envious
lifestyle that they have held in high esteem as the 'American Dream'

You see, the problem is not with the earth having enough land for all
its people - the problem is with earth providing ad infinitum for all
the needs the people crave.

The more people born, the more heat is produced from their life and
all their cravings, As such, the warmer and more polluted the earth
gets and the more energy they all use and the earths resources are
depleted.

Fueling the problem of consumption is the games the Federal and World
banks play with interest rates. They manage the economies in ways to
fuel consumption and mask the real trend. Witness the recent cries for
Federal bankers to lower interest rates...so the stock market can go
up...fueled by spending of the consumer.

It is drug habit that Greenspan got us hooked on and we just can't get
away from.

Our economy is not based on sustainable health - it is based low
interest credit to encourage compulsive spending, debt and living a
life of constant consumption with a 'disposable mentality' when it
comes to durable goods.

All this consumption to artificially fuel our economy to make our
retirement funds only go up contributes to more and more global
warming and the depletion of our natural resources. Then the
governments juggle the numbers to make the inflation figures seem
artificially low, so everyone's retirement portfolio will make them
happy so they will continue to buy and consume more...and on it
goes....IT IS ALL WE KNOW

You see, no other animal destroys its environment except mankind. We
are the only ones that do not accept and live within our comfortable
means. We not only debt with our finances we debt with our
environment. What we are borrowing in terms of petroleum, coal and
natural gas takes millions of years for nature to make. Yet we are
using it all up in just a few hundred years...we can never pay it
back.

I think our countries future will be....'America...a Democratic,
Communist Nation Under God.'

And maybe I am using the wrong word with communism? Maybe it should be
Nationalism? Socialism? I don't know since I have little interest in
politics.

As far for what I means, it could be compared somewhat to Plato's
Republic. Where the republic came first and people came second. But
with the US, the injection of Democratic values as well as a spiritual
foundation that supports our country would 'hopefully' separate us
from the atheist based communists that have been run as
dictatorships.

Without energy our country is open for takeover ... no jets...no
tanks...no transport on the ground or in the air. Luckily we will
still have nuclear powered submarines and aircraft carriers as long as
the uranium holds out. But the jets on the flattop all use jet fuel.
All the supplies for those subs and carriers petroleum dependent. So
long before the crude dries up the government must 'secure a supply'
of crude for it own needs.

Other countries such as Russia that have a good supply of crude may
not be so kind to keep on selling it to us and we need a 'local and
continual' source somewhat within our borders. You see, jet fuel as
well as gasoline deteriorates and cannot be stored indefinitely. So we
must always be producing some of it to replace the stale stuff to
supply the military. But, that's why we elect politicians to deal with
these troubles

As our world changes and our drug supply dries up, things will only
get worse. And the bigger the city - the bigger the hellhole it will
become. And this time RIGHT NOW is the defining moment as to whether
most of our population will die off or not in the crisis that awaits
us in the not so distant future.

When it comes to the future, I see people living in miniature houses
(the lucky ones that survive that is, after all most of the population
died off long ago from starvation, freezing to death or from the
riots) with roofs shingled completely with solar material.

They drive up to their house on an electric scooter that is recharged
from their solar roof. If they are higher up the totem pole they may
have a solar golf cart. But in either case, luck must still be on
their side for without the sun shinning to charge it, their
transportation sits idle. (Not much lead left to build big
batteries...China gobbled it all up, so we have to make due with very
small storage cells.)

They work for the government and in exchange the government feeds and
clothes them from their warehouses. You see, we have become a sort of
'Communist Democracy' for without that bold leap and a desire 'to put
our country first' Russia or China would have stepped in to acquire
some new real estate.

The warehouses are fed from government owned coal fired steam
locomotives. Diesel dried up long ago, so it was either wood or coal
to fuel the trains. It did not take our government long to realize
this. the electric plants only had to shut down sporadically for 8
months so until they could build the first of a large fleet of steam
locomotives.

This was a 'slight' government oversight. They never figured that the
coal fired power plants were fed with 'diesel powered' locomotives.
They kept concentrated on the prediction that we had a hundred of
years of coal left, but were oblivious as to how that coal is
delivered to the power plant. But all these changes have some bright
spots in them. As the coal producers were able to hire many more
workers to manually mine coal, as the diesel powered mining equipment
sit idle from lack of diesel fuel.

Now some of the states or bigger cities had the foresight to build one
or two electric rail trolleys for public transport. Your only problem
is getting to the main road to catch the trolley and then it is a
straight ride to the government warehouse.

What happened to Private industry & Money?

Money is nothing more than stored energy. But since the crude dried
up, the 'real energy' behind the money has vanished...and so did
private industry. What about the coal mines...all government owned. If
you want to eat you work..it is that simple.

So, what is money good for nowadays...to wipe your ass?

Not really, the government supplied toilet paper works better than
that.

Martha Stewart syndrome died out long ago, now people are happy to eat
rice and beans and get a clean glass of water to drink.

After all, the government can't afford to fool around decorating
everyone's house, they can hardly produce enough food to keep a
fraction of the population alive. Yes, tractors, reapers and farming
is very crude intensive...but no one bothered to think about that as
they continued to squander the worlds petroleum resources.

On a positive note, since most of the population died off from
'natural causes', the government does not have to worry about passing
'population control' any longer. They tried to get that universally
opposed program passed for many years, but the public just would not
go for it...too UN-American...goes against our religious
upbringings...too controversial and all of the rest. We can still hear
the cries now...Communist!...Atheist!...Baby
Killer....Hitler....Impeach the President!!!!

Such objections are only subjective and prejudicial states of mind.
As such, all problems related to 'controversial subjects' such as this
are problems created in the mind...the mind of ego based, prejudicial
man. If you find yourself being distracted with such thoughts as 'too
controversial' just ask yourself if the proposed controversy is true,
false or I don't know?

This introspective method may help you become truth based and not ego
based. You will have made a 'choice divorced of need'...you wont 'need
your ego' to support the truth...the truth will be able to stand on
its own.

But nature helped us humans out with that hard decision - for nature
does not discriminate nor find the truth too controversial or
provocative or opinionated to be true. And in the end, nature settled
the dispute of population control with even handed justice of 75% of
our population dying off, ever reminding us all that nature does not
bow to man...it is always man that bows to nature.

But, people hold no grudges against nature and are more in harmony
with nature and enjoy a simpler life nowadays. People pick pine
needles from trees to make their tea, since there is no jet fuel to
import any Darjeeling tea or coffee. Once in a while people are able
to kill a bird, a rat or cat to supplement their diet - so we still
can find a place of gratitude in our life for such gifts.

Of course one problem still haunts the world?

The last remaining buckets of crude will soon be gone and they have
still not found out how to make the tires for the solar powered golf
carts and scooters without that critical ingredient of crude oil?

Add it all together and you have 'America...a Democratic, Communist
Nation Under God.' as the 'best fit ' equation.

And for dessert add 'politics as usual' and we can see nothing
substantive will be done in the US to fix our energy woes until it is
too late. (Really it can't be fixed, we can only slowed down the
inevitable at this point.)

See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_Killed_the_Electric_Car%3F


BTW, do I like communism?

No, I like things EXACTLY as they are. But what I like doesn't
matter...neither does what you like matter. That's the point, for the
US to survive, we must put 'what matters to our country' on the front
burner. And as our country survives so do we survive.

Alan Watts used to say, it doesn't matter what you think, it doesn't
matter what you like, it doesn't matter what you hope for...all that
really matters is what IS.

Sure we keep our treasured paper money, our guns, and what have you.
The atheists can still be atheists and the Christians, Muslims and
Jews can still worship as they like...that is why we would be a free
democracy...of sorts.

But the difference is, instead of the ego based decisions that
politicians and the titans of business get sucked into, they will put
the long term viability as top priority over personal profit. We must
all pull together and stop pulling in counterproductive directions.

The gov needs to cut the fat and stop all this foolish sickness that
they are addicted to in Washington. Hire yourself some truth based
philosophers and futurists as Socrates suggested in the Republic as an
oversight committee to keep you guys on track.

One important thing would be to add an addendum to the constitution or
bill of rights or whatever other documents that outlines what we are
'now' all about...something that is clear advice that we can all look
to and not the 1000 page BS that politician use to hide their
sickness.

And yes,...hiding behavior is a signpost of die-ease.

And put it right upfront in the addendum as to why things changed...we
were energy whores and had no other choice.

But realize this, throughout history many great nations that once were
are not around any longer. Hopefully the US will understand this and
start accepting the truth that something has to give and it can't be
business as usual...it doesn't matter what you like...it doesn't
matter what you hope for...all that really matters is what is.


See:

http://www.algore.org/forum/al_gore_news_and_events/gores_work_combat_climate_crisis/why_dont_we_do_anything_about_global_

http://www.amazon.com/Out-Gas-End-Age-Oil/dp/0393058573

http://www.amazon.com/Hubberts-Peak-Impending-World-Shortage/dp/0691116253

http://www.lastoilshock.com/

http://www.sonyclassics.com/whokilledtheelectriccar/

http://www.amazon.com/Resource-Wars-Landscape-Conflict-Introduction/dp/0805055762

http://www.amazon.com/Long-Emergency-Converging-Catastrophes-Twenty-First/dp/0871138883

http://dieoff.org/






Take care,


V (Male)

Agnostic Freethinker
Practical Philosopher
Futurist
JakeD
2007-10-29 18:41:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by V
Hey..whats the deal with the YANKS posts?
He's obviously got far more of a grudge against Americans that most
Brits do. I won't try to guess why. Most Brits get along just fine
with Americans, and vice-versa. At the end of the day, I believe
there are good and bad in both countries. We are all human, and our
countries have all made greivous mistakes in the past. None of us
today can be blamed for that. As the people of today, we are all
victims of circumstances beyond our control, eg., the sins of our
forefathers, conditioning, and politically-biased education, etc. As
you did, I suggest we forget the past (especially the past of which we
today cannot be blamed) and look forward and cooperate in the interest
of survival.

JD
Frank Gilliland
2007-10-29 19:57:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by JakeD
Post by V
Hey..whats the deal with the YANKS posts?
He's obviously got far more of a grudge against Americans that most
Brits do. I won't try to guess why. Most Brits get along just fine
with Americans, and vice-versa. At the end of the day, I believe
there are good and bad in both countries. We are all human, and our
countries have all made greivous mistakes in the past. None of us
today can be blamed for that. As the people of today, we are all
victims of circumstances beyond our control, eg., the sins of our
forefathers, conditioning, and politically-biased education, etc. As
you did, I suggest we forget the past (especially the past of which we
today cannot be blamed) and look forward and cooperate in the interest
of survival.
I agree we should cooperate, but not to forget the past. And remember
not to hold grudges, but so we can at least try to prevent such things
from happening again.
JakeD
2007-10-29 19:11:03 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:57:54 -0800, Frank Gilliland
Post by Frank Gilliland
Post by JakeD
Post by V
Hey..whats the deal with the YANKS posts?
He's obviously got far more of a grudge against Americans that most
Brits do. I won't try to guess why. Most Brits get along just fine
with Americans, and vice-versa. At the end of the day, I believe
there are good and bad in both countries. We are all human, and our
countries have all made greivous mistakes in the past. None of us
today can be blamed for that. As the people of today, we are all
victims of circumstances beyond our control, eg., the sins of our
forefathers, conditioning, and politically-biased education, etc. As
you did, I suggest we forget the past (especially the past of which we
today cannot be blamed) and look forward and cooperate in the interest
of survival.
I agree we should cooperate, but not to forget the past. And remember
not to hold grudges, but so we can at least try to prevent such things
from happening again.
Sure thing. I agree entirely.

JD
not the moderator
2007-10-29 21:09:21 UTC
Permalink
If it wasn't for the yanks, you assholes would be posting on a German
language news group, or reposing as a bar of soap or lampshade in some
politicians house.
Chris X
2007-10-29 21:10:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by not the moderator
If it wasn't for the yanks, you assholes would be posting on a German
language news group, or reposing as a bar of soap or lampshade in some
politicians house.
FOAD, you daft Moronican twat.
The Rifleman
2007-10-29 22:19:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by not the moderator
If it wasn't for the yanks, you assholes would be posting on a German
language news group, or reposing as a bar of soap or lampshade in some
politicians house.
FOAD, you daft Moronican twat. But chris dont you realise the moronicans
won every war in history all on their own, especially WW1 & 2 even though
they waited til the tide of both wars had long since turned, Oh and dont
forget their stunning victories in Korea, Vietna, Somalis, Iran and Iraq.
Chris X
2007-10-29 22:34:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris X
Post by not the moderator
If it wasn't for the yanks, you assholes would be posting on a German
language news group, or reposing as a bar of soap or lampshade in some
politicians house.
FOAD, you daft Moronican twat.
But chris dont you realise the moronicans won every war in history all on
their own, especially WW1 & 2 even though they waited til the tide of
both wars had long since turned, Oh and dont forget their stunning
victories in Korea, Vietna, Somalis, Iran and Iraq.
Oh yes, hedging their bets and always taking on the weaker adversary. The
hallmarks of the psychotic bully.
not the moderator
2007-10-30 22:18:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris X
Post by Chris X
Post by not the moderator
If it wasn't for the yanks, you assholes would be posting on a German
language news group, or reposing as a bar of soap or lampshade in some
politicians house.
FOAD, you daft Moronican twat.
But chris dont you realise the moronicans won every war in history all on
their own, especially WW1 & 2 even though they waited til the tide of
both wars had long since turned, Oh and dont forget their stunning
victories in Korea, Vietna, Somalis, Iran and Iraq.
Oh yes, hedging their bets and always taking on the weaker adversary. The
hallmarks of the psychotic bully.
You act afraid of us.
h***@hotmail.com
2007-10-31 02:13:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris X
Post by Chris X
Post by not the moderator
If it wasn't for the yanks, you assholes would be posting on a German
language news group, or reposing as a bar of soap or lampshade in some
politicians house.
FOAD, you daft Moronican twat.
But chris dont you realise the moronicans won every war in history all on
their own, especially WW1 & 2 even though they waited til the tide of
both wars had long since turned, Oh and dont forget their stunning
victories in Korea, Vietna, Somalis, Iran and Iraq.
Oh yes, hedging their bets and always taking on the weaker adversary. The
hallmarks of the psychotic bully.
Indeed, all the way back to 1776...
not the moderator
2007-10-30 22:17:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by not the moderator
If it wasn't for the yanks, you assholes would be posting on a German
language news group, or reposing as a bar of soap or lampshade in some
politicians house.
FOAD, you daft Moronican twat. But chris dont you realise the moronicans
won every war in history all on their own, especially WW1 & 2 even though
they waited til the tide of both wars had long since turned, Oh and dont
forget their stunning victories in Korea, Vietna, Somalis, Iran and Iraq.
I'll bet those countries don't want to go again. Except for Iraq, those
were Democrat
activities. We're not done in Iraq or Iran. Still lots of Arabs to kill.
not the moderator
2007-10-30 22:15:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris X
Post by not the moderator
If it wasn't for the yanks, you assholes would be posting on a German
language news group, or reposing as a bar of soap or lampshade in some
politicians house.
FOAD, you daft Moronican twat.
Truth hurt?
h***@hotmail.com
2007-10-31 02:10:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by V
Hardy Har Har Har, Those super roughy toughy brave yanks are at it again,
They invade Iraq, Wreck the place but then are to afraid to go there
Hey..whats the deal with the YANKS posts?
His wife left him for a Yank.
Post by V
You got a hard-on for YANKS rifleman?
Ayup.
Post by V
We are all here to help each other out aren't we?
Not Bugleman. He has a bugle on his cap and wants everyone to know it.
h***@hotmail.com
2007-10-31 02:06:23 UTC
Permalink
US threat over Iraq embassy staff
The US state department has said it may have to force some diplomats to work
in Iraq to fill vacancies at the embassy in Baghdad.
About 250 foreign service staff are to be told they are "prime candidates"
for nearly 50 jobs, state department human resources director Harry Thomas
said.
If too few people volunteer, some will be ordered to go and risk dismissal
if they refuse, Mr Thomas said.
Iraq postings have previously been filled on a voluntary basis.
Vietnam precedent
Mr Thomas said he hoped enough diplomats would volunteer to fill the
one-year postings but that "we have many options, including dismissal from
the foreign service".
The "prime candidates" will be informed by post on Monday and have 10 days
to reply.
To sweeten the deal, an attractive financial package is being offered as
well as a generous leave allowance.
The Baghdad embassy is considered a hardship posting by US diplomats because
of the security risks and because spouses and children must be left at home.
American diplomats have been forced to work in undesirable postings before.
Some were given no choice but to take postings in some African countries in
the 1970s and 1980s and in 1969 an entire class of new foreign service
officers was sent to Vietnam.
Story from BBC NEWS:http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/7065019.stm
Published: 2007/10/27 04:21:17 GMT
© BBC MMVII
I'm good with that. Perhaps if Clinton had taken American Embassies
as seriously instead of just soaking up more bombings...
Ralph
2008-01-17 02:47:16 UTC
Permalink
If it weren't for the Yanks you'd be speaking German right about now,
and a lot more politely.
Myal
2008-01-17 04:34:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ralph
If it weren't for the Yanks you'd be speaking German right about now,
and a lot more politely.
get it right , they'd be speaking russian
Jerry
2008-01-17 05:19:10 UTC
Permalink
http://members.tripod.com/mise_eire/RunAway.html

Life imitates Monty Python - British army says, "Run Away!!!!!"
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 11:17:59 UTC
Permalink
British army has not lost awar in hundreds of years, the yanks lose a war on
an average of every 30 years.
FriarTuck
2008-01-17 11:58:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
British army has not lost awar in hundreds of years, the yanks lose a
war on an average of every 30 years.
thats a bit of a stretch of the imagination, we would in all likelihood
have lost WW1 and WWII if the yanks had not decided it was in their
interest to join in.

much as I dislike the current yank rulers (and undoubtedly the next set
of corporate stooges too), we do at least owe them (quite close relatives
of ours...) some thanks for helping out twice before.
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 12:19:45 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by FriarTuck
Post by The Rifleman
British army has not lost awar in hundreds of years, the yanks lose a
war on an average of every 30 years.
thats a bit of a stretch of the imagination, we would in all likelihood
have lost WW1 and WWII if the yanks had not decided it was in their
interest to join in.
Err NO, They arrived in the closing months of ww1 after the germans were
finally seeing sense, In ww2 they did not join in because of any interest,
they joined in because Germany declared war on them after the Japs attacked
pearl harbour, they certainly made an honourable contribution.
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-17 12:28:48 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 12:19:45 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by FriarTuck
Post by The Rifleman
British army has not lost awar in hundreds of years, the yanks lose a
war on an average of every 30 years.
thats a bit of a stretch of the imagination, we would in all likelihood
have lost WW1 and WWII if the yanks had not decided it was in their
interest to join in.
Err NO, They arrived in the closing months of ww1 after the germans were
finally seeing sense, In ww2 they did not join in because of any interest,
they joined in because Germany declared war on them after the Japs attacked
pearl harbour, they certainly made an honourable contribution.
We joined the war to Save the Queen of England.
GOD SAVE THE QUEEN!

When He didn't do it, well, you got the next best thing.

Our landscape is covered with the graves of the brave men and women
who came to your rescue. Let us bend our heads in a moment of silence
to remember their ultimate sacrifice.

Lg
US
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 13:06:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Our landscape is covered with the graves of the brave men and women
who came to your rescue. Let us bend our heads in a moment of silence
to remember their ultimate sacrifice.
Lg
US
Bullshit, they did not come to our rescue, firstly the US was no where near
any fighting for the first two years of the war, during which the Brits,
commonwealth but primarily the russians turned back the nazis, the US was
adamant it was not going to get involved right up to the point the japs
attacked pearl harbour followed by adolf declaring war on the US. The
Americans did nothing for two years, in fact after Pearl it was the hard
pushed British who helped the US in the Pacific.

the British landscape is covered with the dead of two world wars and the war
in korea where the Brits saved the Yanks.
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-17 13:16:08 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:06:48 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Our landscape is covered with the graves of the brave men and women
who came to your rescue. Let us bend our heads in a moment of silence
to remember their ultimate sacrifice.
Lg
US
Bullshit, they did not come to our rescue, firstly the US was no where near
any fighting for the first two years of the war, during which the Brits,
Lend/Lease ring a bell?
Post by The Rifleman
commonwealth but primarily the russians turned back the nazis, the US was
adamant it was not going to get involved right up to the point the japs
attacked pearl harbour followed by adolf declaring war on the US.
adolph declared war on the US. riiiight. Like you and I can declare
war on the Taliban. Good luck with that.
Post by The Rifleman
The
Americans did nothing for two years, in fact after Pearl it was the hard
pushed British who helped the US in the Pacific.
Eh? Tarawa, Kwajelien, Guam, Solomon Islands? You say the British
were there hu?
Post by The Rifleman
the British landscape is covered with the dead of two world wars and the war
in korea where the Brits saved the Yanks.
Oh right, the Brits were in Korea. That was back in the days when
"The Sun never set on the British Empire"

Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.

Lg
FriarTuck
2008-01-17 13:42:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
Lg
I think that operation is still a work in progress and has gone somewhat
underground, or rather a huge cover put over it....
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 13:49:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by The Rifleman
Bullshit, they did not come to our rescue, firstly the US was no where near
any fighting for the first two years of the war, during which the Brits,
Lend/Lease ring a bell?
R Yup no american forces were involved it was a busioness deal nothing more
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by The Rifleman
commonwealth but primarily the russians turned back the nazis, the US was
adamant it was not going to get involved right up to the point the japs
attacked pearl harbour followed by adolf declaring war on the US.
adolph declared war on the US. riiiight. Like you and I can declare
war on the Taliban. Good luck with that.
Yes adolf Hitler declared war on the united states, did you not cover that
in school?
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by The Rifleman
The
Americans did nothing for two years, in fact after Pearl it was the hard
pushed British who helped the US in the Pacific.
Eh? Tarawa, Kwajelien, Guam, Solomon Islands? You say the British
were there hu?
The British and Australian navy had cruisers and carriers support the USN
right across the pacific, right up to 6the bombardment at okinawa
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by The Rifleman
the British landscape is covered with the dead of two world wars and the war
in korea where the Brits saved the Yanks.
Oh right, the Brits were in Korea. That was back in the days when
"The Sun never set on the British Empire"
Yup The brits did the main fighting when the US marine forces fled south,
the gloucester regiment sacrificed itself so the yanks could run to pusan
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-17 13:58:13 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
2008-01-17 14:21:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
--
Dirk

http://www.transcendence.me.uk/ - Transcendence UK
Remote Viewing classes in London
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-17 14:30:06 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 15:42:56 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?
None
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-17 18:34:02 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:42:56 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?
None
Liar
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 20:19:48 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:42:56 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it,
In
fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?
None
Liar
No , none the Brits were not driven out of India.
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-17 20:26:43 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 20:19:48 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:42:56 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it,
In
fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?
None
Liar
No , none the Brits were not driven out of India.
Who exactly did Mahatma Gandhi and his following rise up against in
dissention? Hint: It wasn't the Israelis.
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 21:20:28 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 20:19:48 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:42:56 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it,
In
fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?
None
Liar
No , none the Brits were not driven out of India.
Who exactly did Mahatma Gandhi and his following rise up against in
dissention? Hint: It wasn't the Israelis.
Jeez you are dumb Gandi was a pacifist, he hated violence in any form it was
his peaceful campaigning for independence that persuaded the British to set
up India as a free democratic nation, go to school and learn something
useful.
Ralph
2008-01-18 02:18:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Who exactly did Mahatma Gandhi and his following rise up against in
dissention? Hint: It wasn't the Israelis.
Jeez you are dumb Gandi was a pacifist, he hated violence in any form it was
his peaceful campaigning for independence that persuaded the British to set
up India as a free democratic nation, go to school and learn something
useful.
Actually it was a growing number of British soldiers killed by post
World War II surplus arms from the Soviet Union in the hands of Indians
that spelled the writing on the wall. With an endless supply of both
Indians and Soviet surplus arms, the British realized it was a fight
they couldn't win and decided to pull out. Gandi gave them the excuse to
deny the real reason they pulled out. This history is absent even from
India's recorded history, but British soldiers killed by Soviet arms
appears in the British military records.
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
2008-01-17 17:08:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?
Far, far fewer than the US in Iraq
--
Dirk

http://www.transcendence.me.uk/ - Transcendence UK
Remote Viewing classes in London
B***@isp.com
2008-01-18 03:46:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world.  What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?-
Didn't you see Gunga Din? It was the British who brought
civilisation to that God forsaken country. If it weren't for
the British they would still be strangling each other and wordshipping
Kali.

It is my opinion that many of these 3rd world cesspits would be
better off if they would invite their former colonial "masters" back
in to clean up the mess they have made of their so-called
"Independence". It must be obvious that the Africans are unable
to manage their own affairs. How many more millions are going to die
of AIDS and starvation before they admit defeat?
No-one died in any British colony of starvation until the
white man left. On the contrary, the people were well-fed,
well-housed, had medical attention, schools, public libraries
and all the trappings of a well run civil service. Now they
are chopping each other up and dropping like flies.
So. Africa is a mess with no-one safe from the black criminals.
AIDS anyone?

Palestine was also better off when it was British controlled.




Hide quoted text -
Post by Lawrence Glickman
- Show quoted text -
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-18 04:39:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world.  What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?-
Didn't you see Gunga Din? It was the British who brought
civilisation to that God forsaken country. If it weren't for
the British they would still be strangling each other and wordshipping
Kali.
It is my opinion that many of these 3rd world cesspits would be
better off if they would invite their former colonial "masters" back
in to clean up the mess they have made of their so-called
"Independence". It must be obvious that the Africans are unable
to manage their own affairs. How many more millions are going to die
of AIDS and starvation before they admit defeat?
No-one died in any British colony of starvation until the
white man left. On the contrary, the people were well-fed,
well-housed, had medical attention, schools, public libraries
and all the trappings of a well run civil service. Now they
are chopping each other up and dropping like flies.
So. Africa is a mess with no-one safe from the black criminals.
AIDS anyone?
Palestine was also better off when it was British controlled.
The way you tell it, everywhere the British went, there was Salvation
for all that were touched by their largesse. What a crock of shit.

British controlled...you mean British RAPED. All your Empire was
interested in was mineral resources, and they didn't care who they
killed in order to get them.

Lg
US
Post by B***@isp.com
Hide quoted text -
Post by Lawrence Glickman
- Show quoted text -
The Rifleman
2008-01-18 11:48:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
British controlled...you mean British RAPED. All your Empire was
interested in was mineral resources, and they didn't care who they
killed in order to get them.
Lg
US
You are making accusations about somewthing that happened 300 years ago,
when you sub human yanks are doing exactly thew same now in Iraq.
B***@isp.com
2008-01-19 04:00:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world.  What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people of India did the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?-
 Didn't you see Gunga Din?  It was the British who brought
civilisation to that God forsaken country.  If it weren't for
the British they would still be strangling each other and wordshipping
Kali.
It is my opinion that many of these 3rd world cesspits would be
better off if they would invite their former colonial "masters" back
in to clean up the mess they have made of their so-called
"Independence". It must be obvious that the Africans are unable
to manage their own affairs. How many more millions are going to die
of AIDS and starvation before they admit defeat?
No-one died in any British colony of starvation until the
white man left.  On the contrary, the people were well-fed,
well-housed, had medical attention, schools, public libraries
and all the trappings of a well run civil service.  Now they
are chopping each other up and dropping like flies.
So. Africa is a mess with no-one safe from the black criminals.
AIDS anyone?
 Palestine was also better off when it was British controlled.
The way you tell it, everywhere the British went, there was Salvation for all that were touched by their largesse.
There were hospitals, schools, libraries, law and order.
Can you say the same thing today? If the darkies don't want
to live under the white mans laws, then why are they all
living in Europe and millions more waiting to sneak in?

 What a crock of shit.
British controlled...you mean British RAPED.  All your Empire was interested in was mineral resources, and they didn't care who they
killed in order to get them.
Africa was not only British, all the European nations had
colonies there. Most of the settlers were farmers not
soldiers. India was not invaded by an army. You need to read some
history books, instead of spewing your typical loonyleft
jew drivel. So. Africa is a mess today with untold 1000's
dying from AIDS and it is well known that the jew had a hand in *that*
as well. Trust the commie Mandela to have as his
right hand man, the commie jew Joe Slovo. The jews control the
diamond mines in So. Africa and we all know who works in them - hint,
not a jew to be seen. Anyone who thinks that
the former European colonies are better off since they kicked the
white man out is either a moron or a liar.
Lg
US
Hide quoted text -
Post by Lawrence Glickman
- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-19 04:09:49 UTC
Permalink
wrote:>>
 Palestine was also better off when it was British controlled.
The way you tell it, everywhere the British went, there was Salvation for all that were touched by their largesse.
There were hospitals, schools, libraries, law and order.
Sure...for the British. Of course, you can say the same for IRAQ.
They have hospitals, schools, libraries, law and order for the
AMERICANS.

Everyone else? Well, they don't count.
Can you say the same thing today? If the darkies don't want
to live under the white mans laws, then why are they all
living in Europe and millions more waiting to sneak in?
Because you're stupid enough to leave your door open to any trash from
the street that wants to walk in for a free meal.
 What a crock of shit.
Is that what's for dinner? I'll pass. Thanks just the same.
British controlled...you mean British RAPED.  All your Empire was interested in was mineral resources, and they didn't care who they
killed in order to get them.
Africa was not only British, all the European nations had
colonies there.
So that makes raping the country OK, because you had company. I see.
Most of the settlers were farmers not
soldiers. India was not invaded by an army. You need to read some
history books, instead of spewing your typical loonyleft
jew drivel.
What makes you think I'm a lefitst, cuntface?
So. Africa is a mess today with untold 1000's
dying from AIDS and it is well known that the jew had a hand in *that*
as well.
PROVE IT.
Trust the commie Mandela to have as his
right hand man, the commie jew Joe Slovo.
Never heard of im.
The jews control the
diamond mines in So. Africa
NO, no nonono....DE BEERS controls the diamond mines. DE BEERS is not
a Jewish name.
and we all know who works in them - hint,
not a jew to be seen.
Because Jews _sell_ diamonds, they don't mine them.
Anyone who thinks that
the former European colonies are better off since they kicked the
white man out is either a moron or a liar.
I can't accuse you of being a liar, but you certainly are misinformed.
As for being a moron? Yah, you qualify.

Lg
B***@isp.com
2008-01-23 02:47:08 UTC
Permalink
wrote:>>
 Palestine was also better off when it was British controlled.
The way you tell it, everywhere the British went, there was Salvation for all that were touched by their largesse.
 There were hospitals, schools, libraries, law and order.
Sure...for the British.  Of course, you can say the same for IRAQ.
They have hospitals, schools, libraries, law and order for the AMERICANS.
You are a moron. Iraq had all of those things before the idiot Bush
even knew that Iraq existed.
Everyone else?  Well, they don't count.
 Can you say the same thing today?  If the darkies don't want
to live under the white mans laws, then why are they all
living in Europe and millions more waiting to sneak in?
Because you're stupid enough to leave your door open to any trash from
the street that wants to walk in for a free meal.
Sounds more like the U.S. who refuses to deport 12 million illegal
spics.
 What a crock of shit.
Is that what's for dinner?  I'll pass.  Thanks just the same.
I didn't post *that* you cretin. *you* did!!
British controlled...you mean British RAPED.  All your Empire was interested in was mineral resources, and they didn't care who they
killed in order to get them.
Africa was not only British, all the European nations had
colonies there.
So that makes raping the country OK, because you had company.  I see.
"Rape"? I wouldn't ssay that word when talking about the darkies,
they might not like it.
 Most of the settlers were farmers not
soldiers.  India was not invaded by an army.  You need to read some
history books, instead of spewing your typical loonyleft
jew drivel.
What makes you think I'm a lefitst, cuntface?
You're a jew aren't you:_>
 So. Africa is a mess today with untold 1000's
dying from AIDS and it is well known that the jew had a hand in *that* as well.
PROVE IT.
 Trust the commie Mandela to have as his
right hand man, the commie jew Joe Slovo.
Never heard of im.
I'm hardly surprised at *that*, you are the resident illiterate
uniformed idiot.
 The jews control the
diamond mines in So. Africa
NO, no nonono....DE BEERS controls the diamond mines.  DE BEERS is not
a Jewish name.
It's jew you moron!!!
and we all know who works in them - hint,
not a jew to be seen.
Because Jews _sell_ diamonds, they don't mine them.
Of course not, too much like hard work.
 Anyone who thinks that
the former European colonies are better off since they kicked the
white man out is either a moron or a liar.
I can't accuse you of being a liar, but you certainly are misinformed.
As for being a moron?  Yah, you qualify.
Lg
Are you sure you're a jew? If so, so much for
"cleverness". You sound more like some red-necked
hillbilly who has never left his shack. Hey, your
name isn't "Jethro" is it??
DarkFire1
2008-01-21 11:47:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people ofIndiadid the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?-
Didn't you see Gunga Din? It was the British who brought
civilisation to that God forsaken country. If it weren't for
the British they would still be strangling each other and wordshipping
Kali.
----------------------------------------
Dear Boedicia, Firstly, Does your breed's academic knowledge of
history, come from 1939 Yankee Hollywood movies based on cheap poems
scribbled by people who doodle "Junglebook" cartoons for a living?

Secondly, if you read below link, I fail to see how British could have
"brought civilization" to India, when it seems that the Greeks who
taught the Romans who then brought civilization to England by the
swoard, learned about the art of civilization (and lost), in India...

No doubt you people learned a lot from the Italians (who learned from
the Greeks) and then were able to conquer India; But don't flatter
your egos about you being "strong" or "civilized" in any way... It was
only because "Indians" were weak at that particular time...

It will be interesting to see if your same sh.t will work now...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurya_Empire

Now since you claim to be a proud English skunhead, let's see what you
folks were doing around 300BC:
http://www.britainexpress.com/History/Celtic_Britain.htm

Oh Cool!! You were being civilized by barbarians knows as the
"Celts"... Way to go! That will show the Italians that your breed can
be civilized by more than one alien breed...
----------------------------------------
Post by B***@isp.com
It is my opinion that many of these 3rd world cesspits would be
better off if they would invite their former colonial "masters" back
in to clean up the mess they have made of their so-called
"Independence".
----------------------------------------
*rotfl*

But didn't you say you were only a "Mistress"? But jokes aside, let's
see how India did before, during, and after the invasion by the
European barbarian hordes....

Poverty and misery in India before the European empire:
http://www.kamat.com/kalranga/ancient/guilds.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurya_Empire#Economy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanchipuram
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vijayanagara
http://www.crystalinks.com/indiascience.html

Prosperity of India during the European empire:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bengal_famine_of_1770
http://www.johannhari.com/archive/article.php?id=909

Peace and stability reigns across your European empire:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_rebellion_of_1857
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rani_of_Jhansi
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Anglo-Sikh_War
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Anglo-Maratha_War
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Plassey

Yearning for the European empire once again:
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_34/b3948401.htm
http://www.time.com/time/specials/2007/article/0,28804,1649060_1649046_1649026,00.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/5290494.stm

(What all this is trying to say in a nutshell Boedicia, is that you
come from a breed of trash - i.e. To be discarded like the trash you
are...)

----------------------------------------

It must be obvious that the Africans are unable
Post by B***@isp.com
to manage their own affairs. How many more millions are going to die
of AIDS and starvation before they admit defeat?
No-one died in any British colony of starvation until the
white man left. On the contrary, the people were well-fed,
well-housed, had medical attention, schools, public libraries
and all the trappings of a well run civil service. Now they
are chopping each other up and dropping like flies.
So. Africa is a mess with no-one safe from the black criminals.
AIDS anyone?
Palestine was also better off when it was British controlled.
B***@isp.com
2008-01-23 03:27:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by DarkFire1
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:21:47 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world.  What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Remarkably few.
BTW, Britain had 10 aircraft carriers at Okinawa.
How many people ofIndiadid the British have to murder before they
were chased out of there with their tails between their legs?-
  Didn't you see Gunga Din?  It was the British who brought
civilisation to that God forsaken country.  If it weren't for
the British they would still be strangling each other and wordshipping
Kali.
----------------------------------------
Dear Boedicia, Firstly, Does your breed's academic knowledge of
history, come from 1939 Yankee Hollywood movies based on cheap poems
scribbled by people who doodle "Junglebook" cartoons for a living?
Secondly, if you read below link, I fail to see how British could have
"brought civilization" to India, when it seems that the Greeks who
taught the Romans who then brought civilization to England by the
swoard, learned about the art of civilization (and lost), in India...
No doubt you people learned a lot from the Italians (who learned from
the Greeks) and then were able to conquer India; But don't flatter
your egos about you being "strong" or "civilized" in any way... It was
only because "Indians" were weak at that particular time...
It will be interesting to see if your same sh.t will work now...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurya_Empire
Now since you claim to be a proud English skunhead, let's see what you
folks were doing  around 300BC:http://www.britainexpress.com/History/Celtic_Britain.htm
Oh Cool!! You were being civilized by barbarians knows as the
"Celts"... Way to go! That will show the Italians that your breed can
be civilized by more than one alien breed...
----------------------------------------
 It is my opinion that many of these 3rd world cesspits would be
better off if they would invite their former colonial "masters" back
in to clean up the mess they have made of their so-called
"Independence".
*rotfl> But didn't you say you were only a "Mistress"? But jokes aside, let's
No I didn't you stupid darkie. I suggest you get out of white man's
land
and run back to that 3rd world cesspit you fled from.
You get more insane everytime you squat down and try
to debate with humans. No wonder you call yourself "darkfire",
although
"darkcretin" would have been more appropriate in your case.
You're just one more stupid 3rd world idiot with the
usual inferiority complex that they show when they
look at themselves in a mirror. There are so many of you in Britain
England is beginning to look like Kaliville.
However, *please* don't strangle anyone, there are
laws against that sort of thing in civilised countries. Also, when
you
are planning to get rid of a wife, if you ever get one,
please don't arrange for the cooking oil to catch fire
while she is doing the cooking. There laws against *that* sort of
thing
also.

Now get back to your begging bowl and *please* keep
taking your little blue pills, you silly little
brownie.
Post by DarkFire1
see how India did before, during, and after the invasion by the
European barbarian hordes....
like the trash you
Post by DarkFire1
are...)
How many more millions are going to die
Post by DarkFire1
of AIDS and starvation before they admit defeat?
No-one
- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Max Muir
2008-01-25 00:45:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by DarkFire1
But don't flatter
your egos about you being "strong" or "civilized" in any way...
I wouldn't dream of it. The UK now boasts Honour Murders,
The Caste System, Voo Doo murders, slavery... it will soon
have the largest mosque in the world.

http://tinyurl.com/ytyu4h

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7156139.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/south_yorkshire/5383386.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/2713927.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/2892747.stm

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.politics.misc/msg/c86efbcd72225208

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2006/09/25/do2502.xml

How can anyone possibly pretend the UK is strong or civilised?
Post by DarkFire1
It was
only because "Indians" were weak at that particular time...
Untrue.

You cite Plassey. In that Battle the Indians were more numerous
and better armed than the British, it's just your side forgot to
cover
up your guns in the rain.

"The Honourable East India Company's army was vastly
outnumbered, consisting of 950 Europeans and 2,100
native Indian sepoys and a small number of guns. The
Nawab had an army of about 50,000 with some heavy
artillery operated by about 40 French soldiers sent by
the French East India Company."

Max

E***@spamblock.panix.com
2008-01-17 15:02:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
In fact
Britain had the biggest empire
Naw. The Mongols have you guys beat. And besides, invasion and
subugation of foreign countries is nothig to brag about.
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 15:46:45 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by E***@spamblock.panix.com
Post by The Rifleman
In fact
Britain had the biggest empire
Naw. The Mongols have you guys beat. And besides, invasion and
subugation of foreign countries is nothig to brag about.
No they did not, We had Canada, Australia, America, Huge chunks of Africa
and Asia , Most of Arabia, The Micro/ poly and mela neasias , and if you
were not a pig thick yank you would see most British Empire achievements
were done by trade. Now look at what the US has achieved in the last 300
years, Its hated by the rest of the world, its allies are dumping it as
quick as possible, its losing war after war and its debts are crippling the
world.
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 15:42:22 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:49:00 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world. What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer
humanity.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
How many innocent people did your country have to murder in order to
accomplish this amazing feat ?
Not as many as America has slaughtered in Iraq and Vietnam
B***@isp.com
2008-01-18 03:40:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by The Rifleman
Bullshit, they did not come to our rescue, firstly the US was no where near
any fighting for the first two years of the war, during which the Brits,
Lend/Lease ring a bell?
R Yup no american forces were involved it was a business deal nothing more
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by The Rifleman
commonwealth but primarily the russians turned back the nazis, the US was
adamant it was not going to get involved right up to the point the japs
attacked pearl harbour followed by adolf declaring war on the US.
adolph declared war on the US.  riiiight.  Like you and I can declare
war on the Taliban.  Good luck with that.
Yes adolf Hitler declared war on the united states, did you not cover that
in school?
It's amazing that so few Americans know that Germany declared war on
the U.S. not vice vera.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by The Rifleman
The
Americans did nothing for two years, in fact after Pearl it was the hard
pushed British who helped the US in the Pacific.
Eh?  Tarawa, Kwajelien, Guam, Solomon Islands?  You say the British were there hu?
The British and Australian navy had cruisers and carriers support the USN
right across the pacific, right up to 6the bombardment at okinawa
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by The Rifleman
the British landscape is covered with the dead of two world wars and the war
in korea where the Brits saved the Yanks.
Oh right, the Brits were in Korea.  That was back in the days when "The Sun never set on the British Empire"
Yup The brits did the main fighting when the US marine forces fled south,
the gloucester regiment sacrificed itself so the yanks could run to pusan
Michael Caine served in Korea.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world.  What a
disappointment you must feel about your miserable failure to conquer humanity.
If the British hadn't "conquered" No. America, *you* would still
be living on some Russian shetel.
The commonwealth is still going strong with over 150 nations in it, In fact
Britain had the biggest empire followed by the biggest commonwealth ever,
What have the yanks achieved?
They won in Grenada:)
The Rifleman
2008-01-18 11:49:05 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
<***@isp.com> wrote in message news:f8d82b0c-c6f9-4611-9f6b-
They won in Grenada:)


It was a near thing as well, but they still managed to drown one of their
own SEAL teams.
soup
2008-01-18 10:28:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Lend/Lease ring a bell?
Note the lease part. US companies were allowed to rent things to the UK.
I beleive the final payment was made on this a few months ago
Post by Lawrence Glickman
adolph declared war on the US. riiiight.
Try Googling http://www.law.ou.edu/ushistory/germwar.shtml
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Oh right, the Brits were in Korea.
Yup http://www.regiments.org/wars/20thcent/50korea.htm#orbat
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Yes, at one time, you *thought* you owned the world.
Like Rome, Byzanteum, Greeks et al we did "own" most of the known world
(including a little place that was to become the USA) but like ALL
empires we became fat,lazy,insular etc and "lost" it all. It is time
for the USA to be the big boy on the block but they like every "empire"
before them will not be "in charge" forever
--
www.cheesesoup.myby.co.uk
Ralph
2008-01-17 19:27:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Our landscape is covered with the graves of the brave men and women
who came to your rescue. Let us bend our heads in a moment of silence
to remember their ultimate sacrifice.
Lg
US
Bullshit, they did not come to our rescue, firstly the US was no where near
any fighting for the first two years of the war, during which the Brits,
commonwealth but primarily the russians turned back the nazis, the US was
adamant it was not going to get involved right up to the point the japs
attacked pearl harbour
The US was infact fighting the U-boat war to supply the UK before pearl
harbor. The UK was not quite as alone against Germany as it claims.
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 20:21:52 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Ralph
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Our landscape is covered with the graves of the brave men and women
who came to your rescue. Let us bend our heads in a moment of silence
to remember their ultimate sacrifice.
Lg
US
Bullshit, they did not come to our rescue, firstly the US was no where near
any fighting for the first two years of the war, during which the Brits,
commonwealth but primarily the russians turned back the nazis, the US was
adamant it was not going to get involved right up to the point the japs
attacked pearl harbour
The US was infact fighting the U-boat war to supply the UK before pearl
harbor. The UK was not quite as alone against Germany as it claims.
Err no it was not, Your top admiral on the Atlantic coast refused to make
ships run blacked out, refused to form convoys and let the coastal cities
keep their lights on silhouetting the ships against the skyline, fortunately
he got sacked after a while.
Jeff McCann
2008-01-17 20:56:06 UTC
Permalink
The Rifleman wrote:
"Err no it was not, Your top admiral on the Atlantic coast refused to
make ships run blacked out, refused to form convoys and let the coastal
cities keep their lights on silhouetting the ships against the skyline,
fortunately he got sacked after a while."

FALSE (as usual, PopGunBoy is displaying his woeful ignorance of all
things military or historical)

The problem was with civilian authorities, especially at the state and
local level, refusing to cooperate with military and USN requests for
blackouts, etc. You see, in America, we are citizens, not subjects, and
are unaccustomed to taking orders from the military, or even from their
civilian bosses in Washington, D.C.

Jeff
Robert Sturgeon
2008-01-17 21:41:31 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:56:06 -0600, Jeff McCann
Post by Jeff McCann
"Err no it was not, Your top admiral on the Atlantic coast refused to
make ships run blacked out, refused to form convoys and let the coastal
cities keep their lights on silhouetting the ships against the skyline,
fortunately he got sacked after a while."
FALSE (as usual, PopGunBoy is displaying his woeful ignorance of all
things military or historical)
The problem was with civilian authorities, especially at the state and
local level, refusing to cooperate with military and USN requests for
blackouts, etc. You see, in America, we are citizens, not subjects, and
are unaccustomed to taking orders from the military, or even from their
civilian bosses in Washington, D.C.
Jeff
You haven't KFed that jackass yet? Whatsamatta widjou?

--
Robert Sturgeon
Alcohol, Tobacco & Firearms should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
http://www.vistech.net/users/rsturge/
Jeff McCann
2008-01-17 22:42:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Sturgeon
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:56:06 -0600, Jeff McCann
Post by Jeff McCann
"Err no it was not, Your top admiral on the Atlantic coast refused to
make ships run blacked out, refused to form convoys and let the coastal
cities keep their lights on silhouetting the ships against the skyline,
fortunately he got sacked after a while."
FALSE (as usual, PopGunBoy is displaying his woeful ignorance of all
things military or historical)
The problem was with civilian authorities, especially at the state and
local level, refusing to cooperate with military and USN requests for
blackouts, etc. You see, in America, we are citizens, not subjects, and
are unaccustomed to taking orders from the military, or even from their
civilian bosses in Washington, D.C.
Jeff
You haven't KFed that jackass yet? Whatsamatta widjou?
I like to keep a few of the more amusing trolls around for their
entertainment value. Anybody herd from Alan Conner or MABU lately?

Jeff
B***@isp.com
2008-01-18 03:52:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeff McCann
"Err no it was not, Your top admiral on the Atlantic coast refused to
make ships run blacked out, refused to form convoys and let the coastal
cities keep their lights on silhouetting the ships against the skyline,
fortunately he got sacked after a while."
FALSE (as usual, PopGunBoy is displaying his woeful ignorance of all
things military or historical)
The problem was with civilian authorities, especially at the state and
local level, refusing to cooperate with military and USN requests for
blackouts, etc.  You see, in America, we are citizens, not subjects, and
are unaccustomed to taking orders from the military, or even from their
civilian bosses in Washington, D.C.
Stupid statement. If you don't take orders from Washington
why bother to elect your reps. I also hope you never have to serve in
the military, if you ever do you will soon learn that if
you don't obey orders something nasty could happen to you.
Post by Jeff McCann
Jeff
Jeff McCann
2008-01-18 04:05:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Jeff McCann
"Err no it was not, Your top admiral on the Atlantic coast refused to
make ships run blacked out, refused to form convoys and let the coastal
cities keep their lights on silhouetting the ships against the skyline,
fortunately he got sacked after a while."
FALSE (as usual, PopGunBoy is displaying his woeful ignorance of all
things military or historical)
The problem was with civilian authorities, especially at the state and
local level, refusing to cooperate with military and USN requests for
blackouts, etc. You see, in America, we are citizens, not subjects, and
are unaccustomed to taking orders from the military, or even from their
civilian bosses in Washington, D.C.
Stupid statement. If you don't take orders from Washington
why bother to elect your reps.
Huh? We elect 'em to handle some things for us, but not everything.
It's called "limited government" and "Federalism," and they are "Public
Servants," not "Public Masters."
Post by B***@isp.com
I also hope you never have to serve in
the military, if you ever do you will soon learn that if
you don't obey orders something nasty could happen to you.
Written like a true Authoritarian. The mere suggestion that everyone
doesn't have to unquestioningly fall in line with our would-be masters
in Washington, D.C. just pisses you off, doesn't it?

Jeff
The Rifleman
2008-01-18 11:53:19 UTC
Permalink
Huh? We elect 'em to handle some things for us, but not everything. It's
called "limited government" and "Federalism," and they are "Public
Servants," not "Public Masters."
Yeah like the patriot act
The Rifleman
2008-01-18 11:52:13 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
"Err no it was not, Your top admiral on the Atlantic coast refused to make
ships run blacked out, refused to form convoys and let the coastal cities
keep their lights on silhouetting the ships against the skyline,
fortunately he got sacked after a while."
FALSE (as usual, PopGunBoy is displaying his woeful ignorance of all
things military or historical)
Not false at all, On your own US made TV documentary about WW"2 they tell
of the admiral in charge of the US east coast who had a hatred for the
Brits, he refused to take our advice on convoys leasding to the seciond U
boat Happy Time, Refused to get the lights turned out along the coast among
other dumb tricks, I cant remember his name but the US govt wised up in the
end and sacked him.
Ralph
2008-01-18 02:18:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Ralph
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Our landscape is covered with the graves of the brave men and women
who came to your rescue. Let us bend our heads in a moment of silence
to remember their ultimate sacrifice.
Lg
US
Bullshit, they did not come to our rescue, firstly the US was no where near
any fighting for the first two years of the war, during which the Brits,
commonwealth but primarily the russians turned back the nazis, the US was
adamant it was not going to get involved right up to the point the japs
attacked pearl harbour
The US was infact fighting the U-boat war to supply the UK before pearl
harbor. The UK was not quite as alone against Germany as it claims.
Err no it was not, Your top admiral on the Atlantic coast refused to make
ships run blacked out, refused to form convoys and let the coastal cities
keep their lights on silhouetting the ships against the skyline, fortunately
he got sacked after a while.
Why was this bad if the US was not already in the fight?
The Rifleman
2008-01-18 11:55:34 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Ralph
Post by The Rifleman
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Ralph
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Our landscape is covered with the graves of the brave men and women
who came to your rescue. Let us bend our heads in a moment of silence
to remember their ultimate sacrifice.
Lg
US
Bullshit, they did not come to our rescue, firstly the US was no where near
any fighting for the first two years of the war, during which the Brits,
commonwealth but primarily the russians turned back the nazis, the US was
adamant it was not going to get involved right up to the point the japs
attacked pearl harbour
The US was infact fighting the U-boat war to supply the UK before pearl
harbor. The UK was not quite as alone against Germany as it claims.
Err no it was not, Your top admiral on the Atlantic coast refused to make
ships run blacked out, refused to form convoys and let the coastal cities
keep their lights on silhouetting the ships against the skyline, fortunately
he got sacked after a while.
Why was this bad if the US was not already in the fight?
Because as per usuial the yanks claim to have saved the world and come like
gallant knights to the rescue when in fact they only joined in after the
japs attacked and the Germans declared war, and agfter the battle of Britain
was long over and after the russians had turned the tide.
Jeff McCann
2008-01-18 14:14:07 UTC
Permalink
The Rifleman wrote:
"Because as per usuial the yanks claim to have saved the world and come
like gallant knights to the rescue when in fact they only joined in
after the japs attacked and the Germans declared war, and agfter the
battle of Britain was long over and after the russians had turned the tide."

Somehow you actually managed to write a single paragraph without any
major factual errors. Congratulations, PopGunBoy!

It's a fair criticism that far two many Americans think we won WWII all
by ourselves, and ignore or downplay the massive role played by our
allies, especially the Soviets. The Battle of Britain did indeed help
"turn the tide" against a German invasion, but Stalingrad was more
"holding a line" than "turning the tide." In the East, the tide turned
at Kursk, I'd say, and not at Stalingrad.

Jeff
Ralph
2008-01-19 01:19:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
Because as per usuial the yanks claim to have saved the world and come like
gallant knights to the rescue when in fact they only joined in after the
japs attacked and the Germans declared war,
The US was in fact escorting supply ships from the US to the UK and
fighting Geramn U-boats before Japan attacked.
Post by The Rifleman
and agfter the battle of Britain was long over
Which the Brits would have likely lost if not for an American invention
known as radar.
Post by The Rifleman
and after the russians had turned the tide.
The tied turned at the battle of Stalengrad which was after the US
officially entered the war.

Churchill said the only thing that really scared him during the war was
the U-boat threat which nearly starved Britian into defeat. Guess which
country sank the most german U-boats, and most of those where sunk by
long range American aircraft using American radar.
soup
2008-01-19 10:33:10 UTC
Permalink
an American invention known as radar.
So the Americans invented radar ? Better not tell Watson-Watt, some
regard
him as the inventor of radar.

The first application of a system that detected an object by radio waves
was actually by a German (in 1904)
--
www.cheesesoup.myby.co.uk
Ralph
2008-01-19 22:45:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by soup
an American invention known as radar.
So the Americans invented radar ? Better not tell Watson-Watt, some
regard
him as the inventor of radar.
The first application of a system that detected an object by radio waves
was actually by a German (in 1904)
Well, American built radar then. The US did lead the fieid and produced
the most advanced radar during World War II.
FACE
2008-01-19 23:06:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ralph
Post by soup
an American invention known as radar.
So the Americans invented radar ? Better not tell Watson-Watt, some
regard
him as the inventor of radar.
The first application of a system that detected an object by radio waves
was actually by a German (in 1904)
Well, American built radar then. The US did lead the fieid and produced
the most advanced radar during World War II.
Uhhh...wasn't the channel side of Britain pretty well covered with a
score or so of radar installations by the time of Operation Sea Lion?

FACE
soup
2008-01-20 14:05:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ralph
Well, American built radar then. The US did lead the fieid and produced
the most advanced radar during World War II.
What a crock.
From:-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_radar

/Although the US had developed pulsed radar systems independent of the
British as had the Germans, there were serious weaknesses in their
efforts- the greatest of which was the lack of integration of radar into
unified air defense system. Here the British were without peer. The
result of the Tizard Mission in 1940 was a major step forward for
utilization of radar technology, both in the transfer of the
organizational knowledge that Watson-Watt had worked out as well as the
British microwave technology. In particular, the powerful cavity
magnetron was the answer the US was looking for, and it led to the
creation of the MIT Radiation Lab, a major center for research employing
almost 4,000 people at its peak during the Second World War./

And the rad lab at MIT was istigated by a brit,Edward Bowen.

/The British need to produce the magnetron[1] in large quantities was so
great that Edward George Bowen was sent as the radar expert in the
Tizard Mission to the USA in 1940, which resulted in the creation of the
MIT Radiation Lab to develop the device further./

[1] The cavity magnetron (a British invention) which allowed smaller
wavelengths to be used which led to smaller antenas that could detect
smaller objects i.e airborne radar detecting submarine periscopes.
--
www.cheesesoup.myby.co.uk
B***@isp.com
2008-01-23 03:35:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ralph
Because as per usuial the yanks claim to have saved the world  and come like
gallant knights to the rescue when in fact they only joined in after the
japs attacked and the Germans declared war,
The US was in fact escorting supply ships from the US to the UK and
fighting Geramn U-boats before Japan attacked.
and agfter the battle of Britain was long over
Which the Brits would have likely lost if not for an American invention
known as radar.
British invention.
Post by Ralph
and after the russians had turned the tide.
The tied turned at the battle of Stalengrad which was after the US
officially entered the war.
"Tied"?

Stalingrad. I spent some time there in 1988
and know the city well. If the Russians
had not joined forces with Hitler they wouldn't
have suffered so many dead. Russia invaded POland in 1939 and by
rights England and France should have declared war on them as well as
Germany.
Post by Ralph
Churchill said the only thing that really scared him during the war was
the U-boat threat which nearly starved Britian into defeat.
Britain. No-one in Britain was in danger of starving at any time
during WW2. Most Britons
grew their own food in their own backyards and had
their own cattle, chickens etc.

Guess which
Post by Ralph
country sank the most german U-boats, and most of those where sunk by
long range American aircraft using American radar.
British radar and most U Boats were sunk by the British. Where *do*
you get your facts??
Jeff McCann
2008-01-24 21:27:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Ralph
Post by The Rifleman
Because as per usuial the yanks claim to have saved the world and come like
gallant knights to the rescue when in fact they only joined in after the
japs attacked and the Germans declared war,
The US was in fact escorting supply ships from the US to the UK and
fighting Geramn U-boats before Japan attacked.
Post by The Rifleman
and agfter the battle of Britain was long over
Which the Brits would have likely lost if not for an American invention
known as radar.
British invention.
Vastly improved by Americans, making it a joint development in military
terms. Much like the A-bomb.
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Ralph
Post by The Rifleman
and after the russians had turned the tide.
The tied turned at the battle of Stalengrad which was after the US
officially entered the war.
"Tied"?
Stalingrad. I spent some time there in 1988
and know the city well. If the Russians
had not joined forces with Hitler they wouldn't
have suffered so many dead. Russia invaded POland in 1939 and by
rights England and France should have declared war on them as well as
Germany.
Technically correct, as to the USSR invading Poland and occupying it's
Eastern portion, putting the Soviets "in bed" with the Nazis.
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Ralph
Churchill said the only thing that really scared him during the war was
the U-boat threat which nearly starved Britian into defeat.
Britain. No-one in Britain was in danger of starving at any time
during WW2.
Yeah, right.

Most Britons
Post by B***@isp.com
grew their own food in their own backyards and had
their own cattle, chickens etc.
Um, Britain was an industrialized country, was it not? Are you trying
to claim that "most Britons" had the ability to keep livestock and grow
their own food in quantities sufficient to sustain themselves? If so,
all the urban dwellers in London, Coventry, and other densely populated
British urban centers must have had much larger yards than any other
equivalent urban resident anywhere else in the world at the time, as
well as plenty of time to tend crops and animals, butcher meat, process
and store crops, etc. So, however did they find enough time for
war-work, since you claim Britons also produced everything needed for
the war all by themselves? Also, who provided the labor for regular
agriculture, with so many men in the service?
Post by B***@isp.com
Guess which
Post by Ralph
country sank the most german U-boats, and most of those where sunk by
long range American aircraft using American radar.
British radar and most U Boats were sunk by the British. Where *do*
you get your facts??
False. Where do you get your facts? Oh yeah, that's right, from the
cinema.

Jeff
Max Muir
2008-01-25 00:21:04 UTC
Permalink
 Guess which
country sank the most german U-boats, and most of those where sunk by
long range American aircraft using American radar.
 British radar and most U Boats were sunk by the British.  Where *do*
you get your facts??
False.  Where do you get your facts?  Oh yeah, that's right, from the
cinema.
Jeff
No, from Churchill's MEMOIRS OF THE SECOND WORLD WAR.

According to Churchill 'Memoirs of the Second World
War', most of the U-boats were sunk by the British.

Page 234, "Memoirs of the Second World War", ISBN
0-395-59968-7

Grand Total of U-boats destroyed: 996

........................................German Italian Japanese
British forces ........................ 525 69 9.5
United States Forces ............ 174 5 110.5
Other and unknown causes ... 82 11 10

==

Max
Jeff McCann
2008-01-25 00:45:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Max Muir
Post by Jeff McCann
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Ralph
Guess which
country sank the most german U-boats, and most of those where sunk by
long range American aircraft using American radar.
British radar and most U Boats were sunk by the British. Where *do*
you get your facts??
False. Where do you get your facts? Oh yeah, that's right, from the
cinema.
Jeff
No, from Churchill's MEMOIRS OF THE SECOND WORLD WAR.
Churchill's figures are in considerable dispute, and, at the time of his
writing, all the facts and reports were simply not available, especially
the German ones. For example, many u-boats simply went missing, were
destroyed in ports, scuttled, sunk by mines, or even turned over to the
Japanese. His figures don't even align all that closely with many
current estimates on total U-boat losses.

You may be right, but I'd be careful in taking Churchill's writings as
definitive. There are many things in his Memoirs that were simply
incorrect, some even intentionally. Interestingly, though, the British
were responsible for many technical anti-submarine developments, some
due directly to Churchill's pushing for them, reflecting his emphasis on
the U-boat threat to Britain's vital lifeline from America and elsewhere
overseas.

Jeff
Post by Max Muir
According to Churchill 'Memoirs of the Second World
War', most of the U-boats were sunk by the British.
Page 234, "Memoirs of the Second World War", ISBN
0-395-59968-7
Grand Total of U-boats destroyed: 996
........................................German Italian Japanese
British forces ........................ 525 69 9.5
United States Forces ............ 174 5 110.5
Other and unknown causes ... 82 11 10
==
Max
Jeff McCann
2008-01-17 21:04:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ralph
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Our landscape is covered with the graves of the brave men and women
who came to your rescue. Let us bend our heads in a moment of silence
to remember their ultimate sacrifice.
Lg
US
Bullshit, they did not come to our rescue, firstly the US was no where near
any fighting for the first two years of the war, during which the Brits,
commonwealth but primarily the russians turned back the nazis, the US was
adamant it was not going to get involved right up to the point the japs
attacked pearl harbour
The US was infact fighting the U-boat war to supply the UK before pearl
harbor. The UK was not quite as alone against Germany as it claims.
No. The Brits, the bulk of their utterly defeated army wrecked and
littered on the coast of France, facing starvation from the U-Boat
menace that they were unable to cope with, were busy sucking on the
American teat for their bare survival until we were ready to bail them
out again.

We won't even get into the fact that Mediocre Britain, with it's weak
post-WWI economy, was simply too broke to hope to fight the war, unless
it was on the backs of American taxpayers and the subjugated colonials
of their evil "Empire.".

Jeff
The Rifleman
2008-01-18 12:01:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeff McCann
No. The Brits, the bulk of their utterly defeated army wrecked and
littered on the coast of France, facing starvation from the U-Boat menace
that they were unable to cope with, were busy sucking on the American teat
for their bare survival until we were ready to bail them out again.
What planet are you on Mccann, you have got to be one of the dumbest people
alive today. Dunkirk was over a year before, prior even to the battle of
Britain which we won, after we had started a second front in africa and
after the soviets started fighting back. You Americans were as usual noted
by your absence from being anywhere near the fighting. Check your history it
was the UK who came to YOUR rescue first after Pearl Harbour, and the Royal
Navy fought along side the USN right across the pacific. Britain was raing
parts of Norway, Denmark, France and North Africa a year before you lot saw
chance to make a few bucks

Oh and lets not forget how it was the Brits and Commonwealth that absolutely
saved the yanks from being wiped out in Korea, another one of your stunning
victories like Bay of pigs, Vietnam, IranSomalia, Iraq etc
Jeff McCann
2008-01-18 14:06:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Jeff McCann
No. The Brits, the bulk of their utterly defeated army wrecked and
littered on the coast of France, facing starvation from the U-Boat menace
that they were unable to cope with, were busy sucking on the American teat
for their bare survival until we were ready to bail them out again.
What planet are you on Mccann, you have got to be one of the dumbest people
alive today. Dunkirk was over a year before, prior even to the battle of
Britain which we won, after we had started a second front in africa and
after the soviets started fighting back.
The fiasco at Dunkirk broke the British army. Thereafter, they couldn't
have even defended England itself, it was so disorganized, demoralized
and stripped of equipment. Fortunately, the RAF did much better and
Hitler turned his attention to the East instead of pressing on against
England, or you'd have been toast. Africa was pretty laughable as a
"Second Front." It was a sideshow, mostly fought against the Italians
on one side, and British Colonial troops on the other. You were totally
defeated in Europe, and the only "First Front" was against the Soviets.
It was American support kept you propped up at all.
Post by The Rifleman
You Americans were as usual noted
by your absence from being anywhere near the fighting. Check your history it
was the UK who came to YOUR rescue first after Pearl Harbour, and the Royal
Navy fought along side the USN right across the pacific.
A laughable lie. In the very early days, Australian, New Zealand and
Dutch naval forces bravely helped the USN hold the line in the Pacific,
but no RN ships fought in any of the major sea battles in the Pacific,
like Midway, Coral Sea, Leyte Gulf, Philippine Sea, etc. (although a few
RN ships caught in the Pacific were sunk by the IJN in the opening days
of the war, and a few other RN ships began to trickle back into the
Pacific after Germany was defeated). Furthermore, there were no Royal
Marines storming ashore on Guadalcanal, Tarawa, Iwo Jima, etc.
Post by The Rifleman
Britain was raing
parts of Norway, Denmark, France and North Africa a year before you lot saw
chance to make a few bucks
Oh, like the disastrous raid on Deippe? You know, the one where so many
Canadians got killed due to British bungling. Or Norway? How long did
it take the Germans to push you out totally? What did you accomplish?
Zip. Nada. Nothing. There was NO WAY Britain could have EVER defeated
Germany without massive Soviet and American involvement in the war.

How was all this "rai[d]ing" going to liberate the Continent of Europe,
again? It was like a mouse scratching the throat of a tiger on it's way
down the tiger's gullet. A nice effort, but far too little, far too
late. You did do a bit of useful work distracting German expeditionary
forces in Africa, but that was mostly colonial forces wasn't it?
Post by The Rifleman
Oh and lets not forget how it was the Brits and Commonwealth that absolutely
saved the yanks from being wiped out in Korea, another one of your stunning
victories like Bay of pigs, Vietnam, IranSomalia, Iraq etc
This old fantasy of yours I have conclusively disproved previously
through official records, yet you persist in clinging to it. Daddy's
favorite "war" story, eh?

Jeff
B***@isp.com
2008-01-19 03:46:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
No.  The Brits, the bulk of their utterly defeated army wrecked and
littered on the coast of France, facing starvation from the U-Boat menace
that they were unable to cope with, were busy sucking on the American teat
for their bare survival until we were ready to bail them out again.
What planet are you on Mccann, you have got to be one of the dumbest people
alive today. Dunkirk was  over a year before, prior even to the battle of
Britain which we won, after we had started a second front in africa and
after the soviets started fighting back.
The fiasco at Dunkirk broke the British army.  Thereafter, they couldn't have even defended England itself, it was so disorganized, demoralized and stripped of equipment.
The British were never demoralised. To the contrary
they were extremely aware that they were fighting alone
and were proud of it. As for Dunkirk being a "fiasco" most of the
soldiers managed to survive and get home to fight again.
If you want a fiasco, I suggest you take a look at Pearl Harbour
and The Phillipines.



 Fortunately, the RAF did much better and
Hitler turned his attention to the East instead of pressing on against England, or you'd have been toast.
Ig Hitler thought that he could have invaded and defeated Britain
he would have done so. The fact that he didn;t should tell
all normal people that he knew he couldn't win.


 Africa was pretty laughable as a
"Second Front."  It was a sideshow, mostly fought against the Italians on one side, and British Colonial troops on the other.
You need to stop watching all those John Wayne films.
You remember John Wayne, the one who never served a day n his life.
I suggest you take a visit to El Alamein. THere are
3 cemetaries, British, German and Italian. There are no colonial
graves there.

 You were totally defeated in Europe,

Almost as bad as The Phillipines where the Japs took over
after 5 mintes of fighting.



and the only "First Front" was against the Soviets.   It was American
support kept you propped up at all.
Post by The Rifleman
You Americans were as usual noted
by your absence from being anywhere near the fighting. Check your history it
was the UK who came to YOUR rescue first after Pearl Harbour, and the Royal
Navy fought along side the USN right across the pacific.
A laughable lie.  In the very early days, Australian, New Zealand and
Dutch naval forces bravely helped the USN hold the line in the Pacific,
but no RN ships fought in any of the major sea battles in the Pacific,
like Midway, Coral Sea, Leyte Gulf, Philippine Sea, etc. (although a few
RN ships caught in the Pacific were sunk by the IJN in the opening days
of the war, and a few other RN ships began to trickle back into the
Pacific after Germany was defeated).  Furthermore, there were no Royal
Marines storming ashore on Guadalcanal, Tarawa, Iwo Jima, etc.
Your anti- British resentment is obvious. All colonial and
former colonials carry the same resentment, it's known
as "inferior complex".
Post by The Rifleman
Britain was raing
parts of Norway, Denmark, France  and North Africa a year before you lot saw
chance to make a few bucks
Oh, like the disastrous raid on Deippe?  You know, the one where so many
Canadians got killed due to British bungling.  Or Norway?  How long did
it take the Germans to push you out totally?  What did you accomplish?
Zip.  Nada.  Nothing.  There was NO WAY Britain could have EVER defeated Germany without massive Soviet and American involvement in the war.
How was all this "rai[d]ing" going to liberate the Continent of Europe,
again?  It was like a mouse scratching the throat of a tiger on it's way
down the tiger's gullet. A nice effort, but far too little, far too
late.  You did do a bit of useful work distracting German expeditionary
forces in Africa, but that was mostly colonial forces wasn't it?
Post by The Rifleman
Oh and lets not forget how it was the Brits and Commonwealth that absolutely
saved the yanks from being wiped out in Korea, another one of your stunning
victories like Bay of pigs, Vietnam, IranSomalia, Iraq etc
This old fantasy of yours I have conclusively disproved previously through official records, yet you persist in clinging to it.  Daddy's favorite "war" story, eh?
How many years did *you* serve? If you are anything like
John Wayne, the answer is "none".
Jeff
The Rifleman
2008-01-19 15:23:18 UTC
Permalink
Bo dont worry about the yanks they are just desperate to claim any sort of
military voctory, even to the point of trying to steal other nations
sucessess. Britain has consistantly won every major war and conflict it has
fought siince 1812, the yanks only constant is how they lost.
Jeff McCann
2008-01-20 16:46:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Jeff McCann
No. The Brits, the bulk of their utterly defeated army wrecked and
littered on the coast of France, facing starvation from the U-Boat menace
that they were unable to cope with, were busy sucking on the American teat
for their bare survival until we were ready to bail them out again.
What planet are you on Mccann, you have got to be one of the dumbest people
alive today. Dunkirk was over a year before, prior even to the battle of
Britain which we won, after we had started a second front in africa and
after the soviets started fighting back.
The fiasco at Dunkirk broke the British army. Thereafter, they couldn't have even defended England itself, it was so disorganized, demoralized and stripped of equipment.
The British were never demoralised. To the contrary
they were extremely aware that they were fighting alone
and were proud of it.
BS. The British people, for the most part, did display admirable spirit
after Dunkirk. But the British Army returned from Dunkirk wrecked as a
coherent, capable fighting force. They lost almost all of their heavy
equipment, crew-served weapons, armored fighting vehicles, spirit and
cohesion. As for "fighting alone," that's a typically arrogant and
clueless British conceit. Forgot already about all the Canadians,
Australians, New Zealanders, Indians and smaller forces from numerous
nations who were fighting and dying for you around the globe from the
beginning?
Post by B***@isp.com
As for Dunkirk being a "fiasco" most of the
soldiers managed to survive and get home to fight again.
Yeah, With much American equipment, supplies and financing, as well as
the time necessary to rebuild provided courtesy of the RAF, The British
maritime community, German indecision, and Soviet sacrifices, not to
mention all those Commonwealth forces who were still in the fight.
Post by B***@isp.com
Fortunately, the RAF did much better and
Hitler turned his attention to the East instead of pressing on against England, or you'd have been toast.
Ig Hitler thought that he could have invaded and defeated Britain
he would have done so. The fact that he didn;t should tell
all normal people that he knew he couldn't win.
Hitler was nuts. He thought Britain might still be induced to join
Germany against the Bolsheviks, so he held off. We'll never know what
would have happened had he pressed the issue. As for what "all normal
people" thought, the conventional wisdom was proved wrong on many things
during WWII.
Post by B***@isp.com
Africa was pretty laughable as a
"Second Front." It was a sideshow, mostly fought against the Italians on one side, and British Colonial troops on the other.
You need to stop watching all those John Wayne films.
You remember John Wayne, the one who never served a day n his life.
I suggest you take a visit to El Alamein. THere are
3 cemetaries, British, German and Italian. There are no colonial
graves there.
You might want to check the "British" order of battle during the
campaigns in North Africa and the Mid-East. You'll learn something. If
their are no marked graves for colonial/commonwealth troops there, then
it's only because of typical British contempt.
Post by B***@isp.com
You were totally defeated in Europe,
Almost as bad as The Phillipines where the Japs took over
after 5 mintes of fighting.
You'd better brush up on the history of the war in the Philippines v.
Singapore, the "Gibraltar of the East." Bataan and Corrigador held out
much longer than Singapore, against much larger forces, than the British
faced in Singapore. The Americans and their stout Philippine allies
held out until their rations, ammunition and all other means of
resistance were gone, about four or five times longer than the British
did in Singapore, then the Americans later fought their way back during
the war. In Contrast, the British folded faster than Superman on
laundry day, with most of their guns unfired and storehouses full, and
they left their POWs and interred civilians to enjoy Japanese
hospitality until the end, when Americans liberated them. If not for
the hard fighting INDIAN 3rd Army Corp and AUSTRALIAN 8th Division
defending the Malay peninsula, the 130,000 or so supposedly well trained
and equipped British Army forces would have caved in almost immediately.
Post by B***@isp.com
and the only "First Front" was against the Soviets. It was American
support kept you propped up at all.
Post by The Rifleman
You Americans were as usual noted
by your absence from being anywhere near the fighting. Check your history it
was the UK who came to YOUR rescue first after Pearl Harbour, and the Royal
Navy fought along side the USN right across the pacific.
A laughable lie. In the very early days, Australian, New Zealand and
Dutch naval forces bravely helped the USN hold the line in the Pacific,
but no RN ships fought in any of the major sea battles in the Pacific,
like Midway, Coral Sea, Leyte Gulf, Philippine Sea, etc. (although a few
RN ships caught in the Pacific were sunk by the IJN in the opening days
of the war, and a few other RN ships began to trickle back into the
Pacific after Germany was defeated). Furthermore, there were no Royal
Marines storming ashore on Guadalcanal, Tarawa, Iwo Jima, etc.
Your anti- British resentment is obvious. All colonial and
former colonials carry the same resentment, it's known
as "inferior complex".
So, do you agree with PopGunBoy's lies, or would you care to try to
defend them, instead of engaging in an ad hominim attack on my motives
in calling out his lies? By the way, the phrase you were grasping for
was "inferiority complex."
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by The Rifleman
Britain was raing
parts of Norway, Denmark, France and North Africa a year before you lot saw
chance to make a few bucks
Oh, like the disastrous raid on Deippe? You know, the one where so many
Canadians got killed due to British bungling. Or Norway? How long did
it take the Germans to push you out totally? What did you accomplish?
Zip. Nada. Nothing. There was NO WAY Britain could have EVER defeated Germany without massive Soviet and American involvement in the war.
How was all this "rai[d]ing" going to liberate the Continent of Europe,
again? It was like a mouse scratching the throat of a tiger on it's way
down the tiger's gullet. A nice effort, but far too little, far too
late. You did do a bit of useful work distracting German expeditionary
forces in Africa, but that was mostly colonial forces wasn't it?
Post by The Rifleman
Oh and lets not forget how it was the Brits and Commonwealth that absolutely
saved the yanks from being wiped out in Korea, another one of your stunning
victories like Bay of pigs, Vietnam, IranSomalia, Iraq etc
This old fantasy of yours I have conclusively disproved previously through official records, yet you persist in clinging to it. Daddy's favorite "war" story, eh?
How many years did *you* serve? If you are anything like
John Wayne, the answer is "none".
Jeff
Since you persist in evading the facts I raised in favor of personal
attacks (a clear sign that you have lost on the merits), I'll indulge
you this one time. Although not a combatant now, I am still in the
uniformed service of my country. You?

Jeff
B***@isp.com
2008-01-23 03:11:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Rifleman
No.  The Brits, the bulk of their utterly defeated army wrecked and
littered on the coast of France, facing starvation from the U-Boat menace
that they were unable to cope with, were busy sucking on the American teat
for their bare survival until we were ready to bail them out again.
What planet are you on Mccann, you have got to be one of the dumbest people
alive today. Dunkirk was  over a year before, prior even to the battle of
Britain which we won, after we had started a second front in africa and
after the soviets started fighting back.
The fiasco at Dunkirk broke the British army.  Thereafter, they couldn't have even defended England itself, it was so disorganized, demoralized and stripped of equipment.
  The British were never demoralised. To the contrary
  they were extremely aware that they were fighting alone
 and were proud of it.  
BS.  The British people, for the most part, did display admirable spirit
after Dunkirk. But the British Army returned from Dunkirk wrecked as a
coherent, capable fighting force.  They lost almost all of their heavy
equipment, crew-served weapons, armored fighting vehicles, spirit and
cohesion.  As for "fighting alone," that's a typically arrogant and
clueless British conceit.  Forgot already about all the Canadians,
Australians, New Zealanders, Indians and smaller forces from numerous
nations who were fighting and dying for you around the globe from the
beginning?
As for Dunkirk being a "fiasco" most of the
soldiers managed to survive and get home to fight again.
Yeah,  With much American equipment, supplies and financing,
You are an idiot. There were no Americans, or American equipment or
"financing" at Dunkirk. You lot didn't even know that a war was going
on.

as well as
the time necessary to rebuild provided courtesy of the RAF, The British
maritime community, German indecision, and Soviet sacrifices, not to
mention all those Commonwealth forces who were still in the fight.
The Russians didn't even come into the war until 1941 and only then
because they were invaded by the
Germans. Just what Soviet sacrifices are you talking about!!
 Fortunately, the RAF did much better and
Hitler turned his attention to the East instead of pressing on against England, or you'd have been toast.
 Ig Hitler thought that he could have invaded and defeated Britain
 he would have done so. The fact that he didn;t should tell
 all normal people that he knew he couldn't win.
Hitler was nuts.  He thought Britain might still be induced to join
Germany against the Bolsheviks, so he held off.  We'll never know what
would have happened had he pressed the issue.  As for what "all normal
people" thought, the conventional wisdom was proved wrong on many things
during WWII.
 Africa was pretty laughable as a
"Second Front."  It was a sideshow, mostly fought against the Italians on one side, and British Colonial troops on the other.
  You need to stop watching all those John Wayne films.
 You remember John Wayne, the one who never served a day n his life.
I suggest you take a visit to El Alamein. THere are
3 cemetaries, British, German and Italian.  There are no colonial
graves there.
You might want to check the "British" order of battle during the
campaigns in North Africa and the Mid-East.  You'll learn something.  If
their are no marked graves for colonial/commonwealth troops there, then
it's only because of typical British contempt.
You are an idiot. Your anti-British bigotry
has destroyed any logical thought you might have
had. You are a know nothing and have probably never served a day in
your life. I repeat, stop watching all those John Wayne films, they
are laughable and when I wasin the military and one of them was shown
in the camp cinema, that's what we did, laugh at them.
  You were totally defeated in Europe,
  Almost as bad as The Phillipines where the Japs took over
 after 5 mintes of fighting.
You'd better brush up on the history of the war in the Philippines v.
Singapore, the "Gibraltar of the East."  Bataan and Corrigador held out
much longer than Singapore, against much larger forces, than the British
faced in Singapore.  The Americans and their stout Philippine allies
held out until their rations, ammunition and all other means of
resistance were gone, about four or five times longer than the British
did in Singapore, then the Americans later fought their way back during
the war.  In Contrast, the British folded faster than Superman on
laundry day, with most of their guns unfired and storehouses full, and
they left their POWs and interred civilians to enjoy Japanese
hospitality until the end, when Americans liberated them.
The British liberated all of the cample where
British POW's were help you silly little
know nothing. Didn't you see King Rat?

 If  not for
the hard fighting INDIAN 3rd Army Corp and AUSTRALIAN 8th Division
defending the Malay peninsula, the 130,000 or so supposedly well trained
and equipped British Army forces would have caved in almost immediately.
and the only "First Front" was against the Soviets.   It was American
support kept you propped up at all.
What "support" ws that?
Post by The Rifleman
You Americans were as usual noted
by your absence from being anywhere near the fighting. Check your history it
was the UK who came to YOUR rescue first after Pearl Harbour, and the Royal
Navy fought along side the USN right across the pacific.
A laughable lie.  In the very early days, Australian, New Zealand and
Dutch naval forces bravely helped the USN hold the line in the Pacific,
but no RN ships fought in any of the major sea battles in the Pacific,
like Midway, Coral Sea, Leyte Gulf, Philippine Sea, etc. (although a few
RN ships caught in the Pacific were sunk by the IJN in the opening days
of the war, and a few other RN ships began to trickle back into the
Pacific after Germany was defeated).  Furthermore, there were no Royal
Marines storming ashore on Guadalcanal, Tarawa, Iwo Jima, etc.
  Your anti- British resentment is obvious.  All colonial and
  former colonials carry the same resentment, it's known
  as "inferior complex".
So, do you agree with PopGunBoy's lies, or would you care to try to
defend them, instead of engaging in an ad hominim attack on my motives
in calling out his lies?  By the way, the phrase you were grasping for
was "inferiority complex."
Which *you* obviously suffer from.
Post by The Rifleman
Britain was raing
parts of Norway, Denmark, France  and North Africa a year before you lot saw
chance to make a few bucks
Oh, like the disastrous raid on Deippe?  You know, the one where so many
Canadians got killed due to British bungling.  Or Norway?  How long did
it take the Germans to push you out totally?  What did you accomplish?
Zip.  Nada.  Nothing.  There was NO WAY Britain could have EVER defeated Germany without massive Soviet and American involvement in the war.
How was all this "rai[d]ing" going to liberate the Continent of Europe,
again?  It was like a mouse scratching the throat of a tiger on it's way
down the tiger's gullet. A nice effort, but far too little, far too
late.  You did do a bit of useful work distracting German expeditionary
forces in Africa, but that was mostly colonial forces wasn't it?
No it wasn't.
Post by The Rifleman
Oh and lets not forget how it was the Brits and Commonwealth that absolutely
saved the yanks from being wiped out in Korea, another one of your stunning
victories like Bay of pigs, Vietnam, IranSomalia, Iraq etc
This old fantasy of yours I have conclusively disproved previously through official records, yet you persist in clinging to it.  Daddy's favorite "war" story, eh?
 How many years did *you* serve?  If you are anything like
 John Wayne, the answer is "none".
Jeff
Since you persist in evading the facts I raised in favor of personal
attacks (a clear sign that you have lost on the merits), I'll indulge
you this one time.  Although not a combatant now, I am still in the
uniformed service of my country.  You?
I served 5 years in the WRAF. Just what "uniformed service" are you
in? Let me guess, you are a bus driver. Boy Scouts?

The first soldier killed on D. Day was a British soldier. Lt. Danny
Brothers. Just thought you'd
like to know, since, if your knowledge of WW2
is anything to go by,I imagine you thought his name was "Wayne".
Jeff- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Jeff McCann
2008-01-24 21:02:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Jeff McCann
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Jeff McCann
No. The Brits, the bulk of their utterly defeated army wrecked and
littered on the coast of France, facing starvation from the U-Boat menace
that they were unable to cope with, were busy sucking on the American teat
for their bare survival until we were ready to bail them out again.
What planet are you on Mccann, you have got to be one of the dumbest people
alive today. Dunkirk was over a year before, prior even to the battle of
Britain which we won, after we had started a second front in africa and
after the soviets started fighting back.
The fiasco at Dunkirk broke the British army. Thereafter, they couldn't have even defended England itself, it was so disorganized, demoralized and stripped of equipment.
The British were never demoralised. To the contrary
they were extremely aware that they were fighting alone
and were proud of it.
BS. The British people, for the most part, did display admirable spirit
after Dunkirk. But the British Army returned from Dunkirk wrecked as a
coherent, capable fighting force. They lost almost all of their heavy
equipment, crew-served weapons, armored fighting vehicles, spirit and
cohesion. As for "fighting alone," that's a typically arrogant and
clueless British conceit. Forgot already about all the Canadians,
Australians, New Zealanders, Indians and smaller forces from numerous
nations who were fighting and dying for you around the globe from the
beginning?
Post by B***@isp.com
As for Dunkirk being a "fiasco" most of the
soldiers managed to survive and get home to fight again.
Yeah, With much American equipment, supplies and financing,
You are an idiot. There were no Americans, or American equipment or
"financing" at Dunkirk. You lot didn't even know that a war was going
on.
Your selective editing of your own words:"As for Dunkirk being a
"fiasco" most of the soldiers managed to survive and get home to fight
again." My response to that pointed out that the British army in
England relied on a substantial portion of American equipment, supplies
and financing, as well as American manufacturing an shipping to get it
to them, to rebuild into some semblance of an effective fighting force.
Post by B***@isp.com
as well as
Post by Jeff McCann
the time necessary to rebuild provided courtesy of the RAF, The British
maritime community, German indecision, and Soviet sacrifices, not to
mention all those Commonwealth forces who were still in the fight.
The Russians didn't even come into the war until 1941 and only then
because they were invaded by the
Germans. Just what Soviet sacrifices are you talking about!!
How can you be so clueless as to be unaware of the huge Soviet military
casualties, as well as the horrendous loss of civilian life, destroyed
homes, farms, cities and infrastructure that the Soviets endured as the
war raged back and forth across their territory, tying up and eventually
destroying or defeating the largest part of Germany's war-making
potential? Really, that is breathtakingly ignorant of you.
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Jeff McCann
Post by B***@isp.com
Fortunately, the RAF did much better and
Hitler turned his attention to the East instead of pressing on against England, or you'd have been toast.
Ig Hitler thought that he could have invaded and defeated Britain
he would have done so. The fact that he didn;t should tell
all normal people that he knew he couldn't win.
Hitler was nuts. He thought Britain might still be induced to join
Germany against the Bolsheviks, so he held off. We'll never know what
would have happened had he pressed the issue. As for what "all normal
people" thought, the conventional wisdom was proved wrong on many things
during WWII.
Post by B***@isp.com
Africa was pretty laughable as a
"Second Front." It was a sideshow, mostly fought against the Italians on one side, and British Colonial troops on the other.
You need to stop watching all those John Wayne films.
You remember John Wayne, the one who never served a day n his life.
I suggest you take a visit to El Alamein. THere are
3 cemetaries, British, German and Italian. There are no colonial
graves there.
You might want to check the "British" order of battle during the
campaigns in North Africa and the Mid-East. You'll learn something. If
their are no marked graves for colonial/commonwealth troops there, then
it's only because of typical British contempt.
You are an idiot. Your anti-British bigotry
has destroyed any logical thought you might have
had.
Nice try at evading the facts with diversion into personal attacks, but
NO SALE. As for bigotry, you've already shown your anti-Semite bigotry
elsewhere on M.S., so I already know the particular flavor of hate and
ignorance filled moron you are. As for me, I actually like and admire
most British folks, who are, unlike you, not utterly ignorant of history.
Post by B***@isp.com
You are a know nothing and have probably never served a day in
your life. I repeat, stop watching all those John Wayne films, they
are laughable and when I wasin the military and one of them was shown
in the camp cinema, that's what we did, laugh at them.
This makes you an expert in military history? Really, watching war
films in the "camp cinema" is no substitute for actually studying history.
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Jeff McCann
Post by B***@isp.com
You were totally defeated in Europe,
Almost as bad as The Phillipines where the Japs took over
after 5 mintes of fighting.
You'd better brush up on the history of the war in the Philippines v.
Singapore, the "Gibraltar of the East." Bataan and Corrigador held out
much longer than Singapore, against much larger forces, than the British
faced in Singapore. The Americans and their stout Philippine allies
held out until their rations, ammunition and all other means of
resistance were gone, about four or five times longer than the British
did in Singapore, then the Americans later fought their way back during
the war. In Contrast, the British folded faster than Superman on
laundry day, with most of their guns unfired and storehouses full, and
they left their POWs and interred civilians to enjoy Japanese
hospitality until the end, when Americans liberated them.
The British liberated all of the cample where
British POW's were help you silly little
know nothing. Didn't you see King Rat?
See what I mean? Thank you for proving my point. You obviously get
your "history" from the cinema!

For the record, The Japanese surrender in Singapore was brought about
AFTER Japan surrendered to the Allies, meaning the Americans, with the
help of many allies, including a minuscule British contribution. Unlike
the Americans in the Philippines, the British didn't have to FIGHT their
way back, they waltzed in unopposed, largely courtesy of the USN, after
thew Japanese surrendered.
Post by B***@isp.com
If not for
Post by Jeff McCann
the hard fighting INDIAN 3rd Army Corp and AUSTRALIAN 8th Division
defending the Malay peninsula, the 130,000 or so supposedly well trained
and equipped British Army forces would have caved in almost immediately.
Post by B***@isp.com
and the only "First Front" was against the Soviets. It was American
support kept you propped up at all.
What "support" ws that?
Most critically, by financing the British war economy; war material,
provisions, fuel, anti-submarine patrols, escorts, diplomatic pressure
on non-belligerents, etc. By the way, you're welcome!
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Jeff McCann
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by The Rifleman
You Americans were as usual noted
by your absence from being anywhere near the fighting. Check your history it
was the UK who came to YOUR rescue first after Pearl Harbour, and the Royal
Navy fought along side the USN right across the pacific.
A laughable lie. In the very early days, Australian, New Zealand and
Dutch naval forces bravely helped the USN hold the line in the Pacific,
but no RN ships fought in any of the major sea battles in the Pacific,
like Midway, Coral Sea, Leyte Gulf, Philippine Sea, etc. (although a few
RN ships caught in the Pacific were sunk by the IJN in the opening days
of the war, and a few other RN ships began to trickle back into the
Pacific after Germany was defeated). Furthermore, there were no Royal
Marines storming ashore on Guadalcanal, Tarawa, Iwo Jima, etc.
Your anti- British resentment is obvious. All colonial and
former colonials carry the same resentment, it's known
as "inferior complex".
So, do you agree with PopGunBoy's lies, or would you care to try to
defend them, instead of engaging in an ad hominim attack on my motives
in calling out his lies? By the way, the phrase you were grasping for
was "inferiority complex."
Which *you* obviously suffer from.
Get that from some film you saw sitting on your arse in the camp cinema,
too?
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Jeff McCann
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by The Rifleman
Britain was raing
parts of Norway, Denmark, France and North Africa a year before you lot saw
chance to make a few bucks
Oh, like the disastrous raid on Deippe? You know, the one where so many
Canadians got killed due to British bungling. Or Norway? How long did
it take the Germans to push you out totally? What did you accomplish?
Zip. Nada. Nothing. There was NO WAY Britain could have EVER defeated Germany without massive Soviet and American involvement in the war.
How was all this "rai[d]ing" going to liberate the Continent of Europe,
again? It was like a mouse scratching the throat of a tiger on it's way
down the tiger's gullet. A nice effort, but far too little, far too
late. You did do a bit of useful work distracting German expeditionary
forces in Africa, but that was mostly colonial forces wasn't it?
No it wasn't.
Post by Jeff McCann
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by The Rifleman
Oh and lets not forget how it was the Brits and Commonwealth that absolutely
saved the yanks from being wiped out in Korea, another one of your stunning
victories like Bay of pigs, Vietnam, IranSomalia, Iraq etc
This old fantasy of yours I have conclusively disproved previously through official records, yet you persist in clinging to it. Daddy's favorite "war" story, eh?
How many years did *you* serve? If you are anything like
John Wayne, the answer is "none".
Since you persist in evading the facts I raised in favor of personal
attacks (a clear sign that you have lost on the merits), I'll indulge
you this one time. Although not a combatant now, I am still in the
uniformed service of my country. You?
I served 5 years in the WRAF. Ooh! I'm impressed! What did you do, other than watch films, I mean?
Just what "uniformed service" are you
in? Let me guess, you are a bus driver. Boy Scouts?
No just easy, non-dangerous stuff like dealing with the effects of of
biological, chemical and radiological weapons or accidents in our
anti-terrorism role, rescuing and caring for victims of natural
disasters, etc., in our peacetime role, or helping the military with
their casualties in our wartime role. Let's just say that when the
feces hits the rotating impeller, I catch some of the splatter.
Post by B***@isp.com
The first soldier killed on D. Day was a British soldier. Lt. Danny
Brothers. Just thought you'd
like to know, since, if your knowledge of WW2
is anything to go by,I imagine you thought his name was "Wayne".
I'm sure Lt. Brothers was a brave and noble soldier. Every life lost is
a tragedy and a sacrifice. However, British army on D-Day had the
easiest job, and suffered a comparatively light 2% casualty rate.
B***@isp.com
2008-01-18 03:35:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 12:19:45 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by FriarTuck
Post by The Rifleman
British army has not lost awar in hundreds of years, the yanks lose a
war on an average of every 30 years.
thats a bit of a stretch of the imagination, we would in all likelihood
have lost WW1 and WWII if the yanks had not decided it was in their
interest to join in.
Err NO, They arrived in the closing months of ww1 after the germans were
finally seeing sense, In ww2 they did not join in because of any interest,
they joined in because Germany declared war on them after the Japs attacked
pearl harbour, they certainly made an honourable contribution.
We joined the war to Save the Queen of England.
GOD SAVE THE QUEEN!
England had a King in WW1 and WW2. and the U.S. "joined"
the war because the Japs bombed Pearl Harbour and Germany
declared war upon the U.S. In WW1 Wilson used the
excuse of the sinking of The Lusitania to bring the U.S. into
the war although the ship was sunk in 1915 *not* 1917. There
was no need for the U.S. to enter WW1 except as an excuse to
join in the spoils.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
When He didn't do it, well, you got the next best thing.
How many years have *you* served?
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Our landscape is covered with the graves of the brave men and women
who came to your rescue.  Let us bend our heads in a moment of silence
to remember their ultimate sacrifice.
U.S. casualties in WW1 were next to nothing and compared
to the U.S. population, the casualties in WW2 were very low
compared to those of other nations.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
- Show quoted text -
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-18 04:34:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
How many years have *you* served?
TWO
( 2 )

and you?
The Rifleman
2008-01-18 12:03:15 UTC
Permalink
--
If you stay ready, you dont have to get ready.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by B***@isp.com
How many years have *you* served?
TWO
( 2 )
and you?
Two, your a bloody recruit.What were you a cook, storeman or just a bitch
for a marine.
B***@isp.com
2008-01-19 03:46:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
 How many years have *you* served?
TWO
( 2 )
and you?
5.
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-19 03:53:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
 How many years have *you* served?
TWO
( 2 )
and you?
5.
couldn't find a job, hu?
B***@isp.com
2008-01-23 02:37:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
 How many years have *you* served?
TWO
( 2 )
and you?
  5.
couldn't find a job, hu?
Says the little jewboy who probably ran away to Canada or did a
Rubin/Hoffman and rioted in the streets against the killing of commies
in Vietnam.

If it wasn't for the British military who fought
alone for 3 years *you* would probably either not
even be here or would have ended up as a lampshade in some Kraut's
dining roo,
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-18 04:37:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
How many years have *you* served?
TWO
( 2 )

I was in the medical corps.
Didn't kill anybody...(knowingly)

and you?
B***@isp.com
2008-01-19 03:51:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
 How many years have *you* served?
TWO
( 2 )
I was in the medical corps.
Didn't kill anybody...(knowingly)
and you?
I'm a woman and I served when women didn't serve on the front lines
and if I had my way they still wouldn't. If it weren't
for those loony left radical so-called "feminists" women wouldn't
be dying in Iraq or even killing others. I saw one on T.V. the other
day - her legs had been blown off. Another one was
captured. It seems she had a 3 year old at home. One would
think that there would be enough males to do the killing.
The military is not an equal opportunity employer, it has one
purpose, to fight wars, not to give persons the opportunity
to earn a paycheque.
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-19 03:57:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Lawrence Glickman
 How many years have *you* served?
TWO
( 2 )
I was in the medical corps.
Didn't kill anybody...(knowingly)
and you?
I'm a woman and I served when women didn't serve on the front lines
and if I had my way they still wouldn't. If it weren't
for those loony left radical so-called "feminists" women wouldn't
be dying in Iraq or even killing others. I saw one on T.V. the other
day - her legs had been blown off. Another one was
captured. It seems she had a 3 year old at home. One would
think that there would be enough males to do the killing.
The military is not an equal opportunity employer, it has one
purpose, to fight wars, not to give persons the opportunity
to earn a paycheque.
The military is a machine. It eats people. It eats enemy, it eats
friendlies. Think of it as an eating machine, and new recruits as
another platter of food being brought to the table. Now you've got
your mind right.

Lg
B***@isp.com
2008-01-23 02:38:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by B***@isp.com
Post by Lawrence Glickman
 How many years have *you* served?
TWO
( 2 )
I was in the medical corps.
Didn't kill anybody...(knowingly)
and you?
I'm a woman and I served when women didn't serve on the front lines
and if I had my way they still wouldn't.  If it weren't
for those loony left radical so-called "feminists" women wouldn't
be dying in Iraq or even killing others.  I saw one on T.V. the other
day - her legs had been blown off.  Another one was
captured. It seems she had a 3 year old at home.  One would
think that there would be enough males to do the killing.
The military is not an equal opportunity employer, it has one
purpose,  to fight wars, not to give persons the opportunity
to earn a paycheque.
The military is a machine.  It eats people.  It eats enemy, it eats
friendlies.  Think of it as an eating machine, and new recruits as
another platter of food being brought to the table.  Now you've got
your mind right.
No wonder so many of your race do everything in their power to stay
out.

Onward Christian soldiers.
Lg- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 11:20:49 UTC
Permalink
Americas great military
In 1812 the Americans thought they could gain a second victory over the
British and invaded Canada without the massive aid provided by France,
Spain and Holland, But by this time the British had defeated Americas
European allies, and were in a position to give the Americans their full
attention, In reply to the Americans invading Canada the British drove the
US forces back across the border, captured the cities of Dearborn, Detroit,
Mackinaw, Benedict, and finally routed the yanks at Bladensburg, from here
the Brits then captured the American capital of Washington, Chased the US
president in person on his horse to Virginia, Captured the Whitehouse and
had dinner there before burning it down along with the navy yard and the
library of congress before the Brits withdrew without meeting any American
resistance
During WW2 following a massive naval bombardment 35, 000 US troops
stormed ashore at Kiska. 21 troops were killed in the fire fight. It
would have been worse if there had been any Japanese on the island.



Korea 1950 the American troops of the 2nd infantry division were driven
from their positions by the Naktong river by the Comchis. British troops
rushed forward to rescue them and to fill the breach in the line. Two Brit
battalions found themselves covering a front of 18,000 yards. During
repeated attacks by the Chinese on a feature known as point 282 two
companies of British troops of Argyles were defending a hilltop and clearly
displaying recognition panels. A flight of USAF mustangs attacked the wrong
hilltop and dropped napalm onto the British troops that had so very recently
rescued the Americans, various accounts attribute the deaths of 6 officers
and 80 men to the american attack.



July 1950

The Brave United states army decided that their could be some north Korean
Infiltrators coming south with the thousands of Korean refugees, so they
simply decided to shoot or blow up everyone. The Famous US 7th Cavalry
regiment among others fired enmasse into crowds of unarmed civilians, the
US forces also blew up bridges that were covered in civilians, at the very
least the US forces slaughtered between 400 and 800 civilians between July
26th and July 29th





Let us not forget the Mai Li massacre in Vietnam where the brave and noble
American troops massacred an entire village of men, women, children and
babies.
In GW1 the USAF attacked two British Warrior APCs in error killing and
injuring
up to 16 Brit troops.
In Afghanistan US forces attacked and killed a detachment of Canadian
troops in error who were training twenty miles inside a designated safe
area.
In the Mediterranean the US mistook an Airbus full of pilgrims flying an
accepted flight path to Mecca for a Libyan fighter and shot it down.
In Iraq the US bombed a civilian air raid shelter killing over 300 women
and
kids.
In Yugoslavia the US attacked the Chinese embassy in error killing many
diplomats.
In Italy the USAF knocked down a ski lift killing many civilians.
In South America the US intelligence agencies told the Colombian Air force
that a plane passing through their airspace was a drug smuggler, so they
shot it down only to find out it was carrying Christian missionaries.
In Iraq The US is only second to the insurgents in killing innocent
journalists, killing about 20 so far.
In Iraq the US killed the Italian secret service agent and wounded the
newly
freed Italian hostage as she was being transported to the airport.
In Iraq the US shot down a RAF Tornado GR4 plane flying in formation after
attacking Iraqi positions, they were squawking accurate IFF transponders,
flying along the accepted return flight path at the correct altitude and
time when shot down by a US patriot missile.
In Afghanistan the USAF attacked a house with a fighter bomber in an effort
to kill one wanted person, but they missed and hit a school sited next door
killing many children.
In Afghanistan the USAF attacked with fighter bombers a wedding party
killing most of the guests.
In Iraq the US attacked a convoy of cars and trucks killing many on board
only to find out they were allied locals responding to a summons by US
forces to attend a meeting.
In Iraq a family of 5 including three children were machined gunned by the
yanks, their crime?, daring to drive along a road in their own country en
route to a family gathering.



In Iraq in an effort to capture or kill 200 insurgents the US laid siege to
the city of Falujah, in the battle that followed the city was almost
entirely destroyed and thousands of civilians killed in the air and
artillery bombardment, The bulk of the insurgents plus their leader escaped
(naturally).





We try not to embarrass the Americans to much about their total humiliation
in Vietnam, Somalia, and Iran or how they managed to drown an entire SEAL
team when they wanted to invade Grenada. Or how an aged arab farmer armed
only with a vintage WW2 bolt action rifle shot down an apache helicopter.



Xmas 2005 A woman who emigrated to the US has been killed by a stray
bullet shot threw her apartment window. Selina Akther was shot in the head
and died instantly at the window of her fifth-floor apartment in the Queens
borough of New York.
Police arrested a US soldier who they said was on leave and had been
drinking when he fired shots into the air.



The US military has apologised for dropping a bomb on the wrong house in
Iraq, killing between five and 13 people.

A spokesman said it dropped the 500lb laser-guided bomb after mistaking it
for a nearby insurgent hideout.

He said the military "deeply regrets the loss of possibly innocent lives".

The bomb destroyed a villa in the village of Aaytha near the city of Mosul.

Locals said 13 people were killed including four women and three children,
while the US military said its reports were that five Iraqis had died.

It is understood the dead are all from the same family.



In May, a US air strike near Qaim, a town on the border with Syria, killed
around 40 people.

Locals claimed that the strike hit a wedding party, while the Americans said
the house was a gathering point for "terrorists".



The US military bombed suspected insurgent targets in the former rebel
stronghold of Fallujah from June until its November offensive

to reclaim the city from insurgents.

US commanders acknowledged that their air campaign in Fallujah claimed the
lives of some innocent civilians.





Soldier Faces Execution



A US soldier has been sentenced to death for a grenade and gun attack that
killed two of his own colleagues during the Iraq war.

The 15-person military jury took seven hours to decide that Sgt Hasan Akbar
should be executed - jurors could have sentenced him to life in prison.

Akbar, 34, threw grenades into tents housing troops from the 101st Airborne
Division in Kuwait and then fired at soldiers as they ran to escape the
blasts.



US Soldier Pleads Guilty

Updated: 22:12, Monday May 02, 2005

An American soldier accused of abusing Iraqis at the Abu Ghraib prison has
pleaded guilty at a court-martial in Texas.

Private Lynndie England was infamously photographed holding a leash attached
to the neck of a naked Iraqi inmate.

The 22-year-old mother is one of seven junior soldiers who were charged with
mistreating captives at the Baghdad prison in 2003.

She has pleaded guilty to seven of the nine charges and has asked to be
sentenced by a special military panel.



Jail For Abu Ghraib Abuser

Updated: 16:06, Saturday February 05, 2005

A US soldier who admitted stepping on the hands and feet of handcuffed
detainees in the Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq has been sentenced to six months
in jail.

Sergeant Javal Davis was also given a dishonourable discharge.

Other guards later stripped the seven hooded prisoners and stacked them into
a naked human pyramid.



Soldier Guilty Of Murder

Updated: 08:44, Saturday January 15, 2005

An American soldier has been sentenced to just one year in jail for the
murder of a severly wounded Iraqi teenager.

He shot the severely wounded teenager in a Baghdad slum district last year.

The US military said: "Staff Sergeant Cardenas Alban was convicted on one
count of murder and one count of conspiracy to murder."

The court martial took place at the 1st Cavalry Division courthouse at Camp
Liberty.

Besides his jail term, he has been sentenced to a reduction in rank to
private and a bad-conduct discharge.



'Bodies For Porn' Probe

Updated: 14:11, Wednesday September 28, 2005

The Pentagon is investigating claims American soldiers posted pictures of
dead Iraqis on the internet in return for access to pornography.

A message board appears to show American soldiers laughing and joking beside
Iraqi corpses.

It is alleged the soldiers who posted the pictures were then allowed to view
pornographic pictures.

The owner of the website said he had offered soldiers free access to the
pornography if they could prove they were members of the American military.

Some soldiers had sent in pictures of Iraqi landmarks while others had sent
in pictures of corpses.



Jan 06

US sailor held over Japan death A US sailor in Japan is being held on
suspicion of involvement in a local woman's death, the US Navy has said.

The sailor is being held in US custody near where the incident took place,
in Yokosuka - where the USS Kitty Hawk aircraft carrier is based.

Yoshie Sato died on Tuesday, after being found beaten and unconscious.



Incidents involving US troops and local Japanese are particularly sensitive
because of a 1995 case when three US servicemen raped a schoolgirl.



14 Jan 2006 US aircraft attack a village in friendly allied nation
Pakistan, killing 18 people including many women and children, they claimed
they were seeking the second in command of Al Quaeda, but that is still not
good reason to invade the airspace of an allied nation and bomb one of its
villages, naturally the target the yanks were hunting was not killed in the
attack





US officer guilty of Iraqi death A US officer has been found guilty of the
negligent homicide of an Iraqi general who was being held in custody.

But a jury of six army officers found Chief Warrant Officer Lewis Welshofer
Jr not guilty of the murder of Maj-Gen Abed Hamed Mowhoush in 2003.

The officer now faces up to three years in jail for homicide. He was also
convicted of dereliction of duty.

Prosecutors say Gen Mowhoush was bound, placed headfirst in a sleeping bag
and died with an officer sitting on him.

It was one of a number of deaths of prisoners in Iraq and Afghanistan under
investigation by the US military.

At the beginning of the trial, defence lawyers called a witness who claimed
he had overheard a juror coming under pressure from a senior officer, and
applied for the case to be dismissed because of "unlawful command
influence".

But the judge rejected the request.

Gen Mowhoush died while being held at al-Qaim in Iraq, near the Syrian
border.

A death certificate published by the Pentagon gave the cause as asphyxia due
to smothering and chest compression.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/4636344.stm

Published: 2006/01/22 06:48:57 GMT

© BBC MMVI





Near-miss US jet crews criticised Two US fighter crews and ground control
staff have been criticised in a report after a near-miss with a civilian
aircraft over Bedfordshire.

The Air Accident Investigation Branch said there was "general confusion"
when the F-15E Eagles from RAF Lakenheath in Suffolk passed close to the
aircraft.

They were at 21,000ft and above the level to which they were cleared to fly
on 27 January 2005.

There were 35 passengers on board the British Airways regional flight.

The captain of BA CitiExpress (now BA Connect) aircraft told air traffic
control he had just seen an F15 pass about 100ft below the nose of the
Embraer 145 and "no more than about 200 yards ahead, descending," said the
report.


Also poor use was made of the highly sophisticated aids available
AAIB report






The report said the fighters passed within about 1,000 yards of the Embraer.

The AAIB report went on: "Inadequate transmission and acknowledgements of
clearances within the formation plus the crews' inability to fly either as a
coherent formation or as two independent aircraft during the diversion were
major contributory factors to the ensuing general confusion.

"Also poor use was made of the highly sophisticated aids available to the
crews in monitoring fuel loads, monitoring ground position and using
airborne radar."

The report was also critical of air traffic control at Lakenheath in Suffolk
for a communication failure which "contributed to the subsequent radar
identification problems".

The two fighter planes were flying from RAF Lakenheath for a close air
support training sortie at Otterburn Range near Newcastle upon Tyne.

During the training exercise, both aircraft became low on fuel and decided
to divert due to poor weather and air traffic delays at Lakenheath.

'Critically short of fuel'

It was some time after this that the Embraer captain reported to
London-based air traffic controllers that a military fighter aircraft had
passed close in front of him.

Eventually the two fighter planes landed safely at RAF Valley at Holyhead in
Anglesey.

The AAIB report said the decision to divert was left too late.

The report went on: "Because they were critically short of fuel, the (US)
aircraft climbed through their cleared flight level, without transponding,
entered controlled airspace and conflicted with the Embraer 145."

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/england/4694932.stm

Published: 2006/02/09 00:33:49 GMT

© BBC MMVI 12 Feb 2006
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/4706902.stm
Two Pakistani nomad women have been killed after a rocket fired across the
border from Afghanistan landed on their tent, Pakistani officials say.
Four children were hurt in the attack late on Saturday in North
Waziristan.
Locals say US-led coalition forces in Afghanistan fired four rockets into
Pakistan's tribal area after coming under fire from unknown attackers.
A US spokesman confirmed coalition forces had returned fire into Pakistan,
but was not aware of casualties.
Post 'attacked'
The incident is the third this year in which civilians have been killed
inside Pakistani territory in apparent missile strikes by US-led forces
who
are hunting al-Qaeda and Taleban suspects in the mountainous border area.
US army to probe NFL star's death The US army is to launch a criminal
investigation into the death of a former American football star who was
killed in Afghanistan.

Pat Tillman gave up his professional contract to join the army after the 11
September 2001 attacks on the US.

It took some time for the US military to admit he had been killed by US
fire, drawing criticism from his family.

The US military has always said his shooting was accidental, but conceded
that a criminal inquiry was warranted.

"We are obligated to answer the family's questions, as we are with all
grieving families," Colonel Joseph Curtin, an Army spokesman said.

He said the scope of the investigation had still to be determined.

'Cover-up'

An unnamed army official quoted by Reuters said the inquiry would seek to
determine whether one of the troops involved in the shooting committed
negligent homicide or another crime.

He said "no one soldier" was the subject of the investigation.

Tillman was 27 when he was hit by gunfire on 22 April, 2004 on a road near
the Pakistan-Afghanistan border. At the time the army said blamed enemy
fire.

The truth did not come out until after his funeral.

His family claims the story was manipulated by the Pentagon to turn Tillman
into a hero of the war on terror.

The footballer had been hailed as a role model when he walked away from his
multi-million dollar Cardinals contract to serve his country.

His father, Pat Tillman Sr, has called the army inquiries so far "shams" and
alleges a cover-up.

The army has admitted that some evidence - including Tillman's uniform and
armour - was destroyed.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/4775362.stm

Published: 2006/03/05 02:07:08 GMT

© BBC MMVI



US soldier abused Iraq prisoners A US army dog handler has been found guilty
of abusing detainees in Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison from 2003-2004.

A Maryland court martial convicted Sgt Michael Smith on six out of 13
charges including maltreating detainees, dereliction of duty and assault.

Prosecutors said Smith, 24, used his black Belgian shepherd to menace
prisoners for his own amusement. He will be sentenced later on Tuesday.

He is the 10th US soldier to be convicted over the abuse scandal.

In one case, prosecutors at the court martial in Fort Meade said Smith
competed with another dog handler to see who could make a detainee defecate
out of fear.

One of the photographs to emerge from Abu Ghraib prison depicts Smith
holding his dog inches from the face of a detainee who appears to be
cowering in terror.

The prosecution said he had violated rules on treating prisoners humanely
and using the minimum amount of force.

The defence had argued that rules governing the use of dogs were unclear.
They said Smith was a good soldier who had done what he was supposed to do
by having his dog bark at prisoners in what it described as dangerous
environment.

The military jury announced its verdict after deliberating for about 18
hours over a period of three days.

Smith was found guilty under the Uniform Code of Military Justice with two
counts of maltreatment, one count of conspiring to make a contest of making
detainees soil themselves, dereliction of duty, assault and an indecent act.

Nine other soldiers have been convicted of abusing prisoners at Abu Ghraib.
Charles Graner received the stiffest sentence - 10 years in jail.

Another dog handler, Sgt Santos Cardona, is to stand trial on 22 May.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/4830362.stm

Published: 2006/03/21 18:17:05 GMT

© BBC MMVI
US military probes Iraq killings
US military investigators have flown to Iraq to study reports that marines
shot dead at least 15 civilians, including seven women and three children.
The incident is said to have happened in Haditha on 19 November 2005.
The military's initial claim that the civilians died in a roadside blast
was
disproved by an earlier investigation.
Investigators will now ask if the civilians died in crossfire or were
targeted in a vengeful killing spree, prompted by the death of a marine.
Iraqis often accuse US troops fighting insurgents of committing war
crimes.
Their bodies were riddled with bullets... there were blood spatters
inside their homes
Bobby Ghosh
Time reporter
Local residents in Haditha say the marines went on the rampage after one
of
their number was killed in a roadside blast and another two were injured.
They say the soldiers began shooting passers-by and the inhabitants of
nearby homes dead.
'Collateral damage'
A military report at the time had said insurgents opened fire from all
directions after the roadside explosion and the marines responded, killing
eight fighters.
In the report, the deaths of 15 civilians were blamed on the initial
blast.
Locals offered a different version of events, and the case was taken up by
US news weekly, Time.
Time reporter Bobby Ghosh told the BBC a videotape, given to the magazine
by
an Iraqi human rights group, had shown the civilians "could not have been
killed by a roadside bomb".
"Their bodies were riddled with bullets," he said. "There was evidence
there
had been gunfire inside their homes, there were blood spatters inside
their
homes."
The magazine says it presented its findings to the US military, which
investigated the incident in January.
The preliminary investigation established that two Iraqi families were
indeed killed by the marines, though it described the deaths as collateral
damage.
Time says there is not enough evidence to show US soldiers deliberately
targeted the civilians.
Now the case has been referred for criminal investigation by the US navy
to
establish whether the 12 marines involved were guilty of misconduct.
Human rights organisations have already said that if the 15 civilians were
killed deliberately it would be the worst such case that has come to
light.
There have been many allegations from Iraqi civilians that similar
behaviour
by US troops has caused numerous civilian deaths in combat situations,
especially during the offensives at Falluja and elsewhere.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/4827424.stm
Published: 2006/03/21 08:39:18 GMT
© BBC MMVI
Report finds U.S. shooting of Reuters soundman unlawful
Monday April 10, 02:56 PM














BAGHDAD (Reuters) - U.S. soldiers who shot dead a Reuters television
soundman in Iraq last year breached their rules of engagement and the
killing was "unlawful", an independent investigation commissioned by Reuters
has found.

Waleed Khaled died and cameraman Haider Kadhem was wounded on August 28 when
the troops fired on their car in Baghdad as the two Iraqis covered the
aftermath of an attack on policemen.

An investigation by the Army unit involved found that its soldiers had acted
within rules of engagement that allow them to fire if they feel under
threat.

But The Risk Advisory Group (TRAG), a risk management consultancy asked by
Reuters to examine the incident, said the use of force was neither
proportionate nor justified.

It said the Army inquiry conclusions were not supported by the evidence --
including the testimony of the soldiers themselves -- and expressed
incomprehension that crucial footage shot by Kadhem had somehow been lost by
the military.

"We conclude, based on the independent evidence and the evidence of Haider
Kadhem, that no hostile act took place and no act could have been
legitimately mistaken as indicating hostile intent," the TRAG report said.

"The engagement was therefore in breach of U.S. Rules of Engagement and, in
our opinion, on the current evidence was prima facie unlawful."

Reuters Global Managing Editor David Schlesinger called on the U.S. military
to order "a full, independent and objective inquiry into this terrible
incident". A copy of the report has been given to the U.S. Department of
Defence for its review.

SHOTS "FIRED TO KILL OR INJURE"

Soldiers who fired on the car from the roof of a building testified to the
military investigator that they saw a passenger hanging out of one of the
windows holding what appeared to be a rocket-propelled grenade (RPG)
launcher.

They said the passenger quickly moved back inside the car before they could
confirm with binoculars whether he was holding a weapon. The soldiers said
they initially fired warning shots and then fired to disable the vehicle.

TRAG reconstructed the incident and found it was impossible to distinguish
an RPG at the distance from where the soldiers fired.

Kadhem said he was filming through the stationary car's windscreen with his
small, hand-held video camera and at one point turned to lean slightly out
of the side window.

Kadhem said shooting began and Khaled reversed at speed. Seventeen bullets
hit the car, which swerved and crashed into a barrier. Kadhem said shooting
went on after it came to a stop.

"Had they not fired, it is unlikely in our view that the car would have
moved in the first place," TRAG said.

The New York-based Committee to Protect Journalists says at least 67
journalists have been killed in Iraq since the U.S. invasion of 2003. U.S.
forces have killed at least 14 of them, the CPJ says.

Four Reuters journalists have been killed, at least three by U.S. forces.
Reuters is awaiting results of a U.S. military inquiry into the death 18
months ago of the fourth.

ARMY "LOST" CRUCIAL EVIDENCE

Kadhem's video footage was seized by the U.S. military when he was detained
and held for three days. The Army showed the footage to Reuters staff but
then said it had been separated from the case file and subsequently lost.

"The 'lost' video contains the very best evidence of what transpired,"



Civilians injured 'by US forces' Six people, including a mother and her
newborn baby, have been injured in two incidents in eastern Afghanistan,
reportedly by American forces.

Both the incidents took place in Khost province. A six-year-old boy was also
injured in one of the incidents.

The reports come as President Hamid Karzai has ordered a probe into the
killing of seven civilians by coalition forces over the weekend.

The US military has also launched an investigation into the deaths.

'Shot at'

The mother was travelling home from a clinic with her newborn baby after
midnight in the Yaqubi district of Khost in the east of Afghanistan when
they were fired upon by US forces, a family member told the BBC.

The mother, the baby and two other women in the car were injured. One of the
women had gunshot wounds in her mouth, doctors said.

Wakil Ahmed, a family member, told the BBC: "We were on our way back home
from the clinic. The American patrol was driving and as they stopped, we
stopped. They started driving, we did the same.

"As we got close to our house they stopped, and we started driving towards
our house. They opened fire on us. Minutes later a translator came to us and
asked who we were."

Then in Khost city a few hours later, another car was shot at by a US
patrol - a young man and a six-year-old boy were wounded.

The provincial police chief said he was investigating both reports.

On Monday President Karzai's spokesman said he was "very unhappy" about the
deaths of seven civilians over the weekend and warned all those involved in
military operations to take more care not to injure civilians.

The civilians were reportedly killed in "friendly fire" incidents during
fighting against militants.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/south_asia/4918022.stm

Published: 2006/04/18 10:25:00 GMT

© BBC MMVI



US test fire kills three Iraqis The US military has admitted that three
Iraqi civilians killed in an explosion on Friday died because of an
artillery training exercise that went wrong.

An artillery round fired from a US military base near Hibhib (about 20km
north of Baquba) struck a building in the nearby town, a statement said.

Two Iraqis were killed instantly, while a third died later from her wounds.

This comes amid investigations of a number of incidents in which civilians
were killed by US troops.

Last week, Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri Maliki expressed concern about the
increase in the number of deadly incidents described as mistakes by the US
military, saying there was "a limit to acceptable excuses".

Most attention has been focused on an incident in the town of Haditha where
US marines are alleged to have killed up to 24 Iraqi civilians in November
2005.

Troops fired the 155mm shell from the base near Baquba, the US military
statement said.

"A short time later Iraqi police reported an explosion at a building in the
town [Hibhib] that killed two Iraqi civilians, injured four others and
damaged six houses," it said.

It added that an injured woman was taken to a military medical facility but
later died.



20 June 2006
Three US soldiers have been charged over the deaths of three male
prisoners
in Iraq, the US military has said.
The detainees were allegedly killed in a military operation near the Thar
Thar Canal in southern Iraq on 9 May.
The charges against the three soldiers include murder, attempted murder,
conspiracy and obstructing justice.
US troops in Iraq have faced several accusations of unlawfully killing
civilians and abusing detainees, prompting inquiries into their conduct.
The US military recently began investigating the deaths of 24 unarmed
civilians in the town of Haditha last year in an attack blamed on US
marines.
Italian bid to indict US soldier Italian prosecutors have called for a US
soldier to stand trial for the killing of an Italian intelligence officer in
Baghdad in 2005.

Nicola Calipari, 51, was shot dead at a US roadblock while escorting Italian
journalist Giuliana Sgrena, who had been released by kidnappers in Iraq.

Italy and the US government disputed the circumstances of his death.

Italian prosecutors want a US marine, identified as Mario Lozano, to go on
trial for the March 2005 killing.


DIFFERING ACCOUNTS

US military : Car approaches checkpoint at high speed

Troops attempt to tell driver to stop with arm signals, lights and
warning shots

Soldiers shoot into engine

Italian government : No warning signs to motorists about impending
checkpoint

Car not speeding and did not accelerate after warning shots

Proper inquiry impossible because vehicles removed and army logs
destroyed just after shooting
http://www.yorkshiretoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=55&ArticleID=1586494
AN American airman charged with raping three vulnerable teenage girls said
each had consented to sex, a court heard. James Gardner, 34, a staff
sergeant with the US Air Force, stationed at RAF Menwith Hill, near
Harrogate, went into the witness box at York Crown Court yesterday on the
third day of his trial. He denies 13 sexual assault charges, including
five
counts of rape, and one charge of assault causing actual bodily harm.
Gardner is alleged to have plied all three girls - aged 14, 15 and 17 at
the
time of the incidents - with alcohol before taking advantage of them. All
three teenagers were living at a North Yorkshire children's home and were
introduced to the airman by a mutual friend.
Marines face Iraq murder charges The US marine corps has charged seven
marines and a navy sailor with murder over the death of a disabled Iraqi
man.

All eight also faced kidnapping and conspiracy charges, a spokesman told
reporters at the Californian camp where the defendants were being held.

They are accused of shooting a disabled man in Hamdaniya in April, and
covering up the circumstances of his death.

It is one in a series of inquiries into the alleged abuse or killing of
Iraqis by coalition forces.

Another Pentagon inquiry is looking into an alleged massacre at Haditha last
November, in which 24 civilians are thought to have been killed.

Roadside bomb

The Hamdaniya investigation has been examining claims a man was deliberately
killed on 26 April in the town in central Iraq.


The marine corps prides itself on holding its members accountable for
their actions
Col Stewart Navarre








The accused are alleged to have taken the 52-year-old victim from his house,
shot him and then left a rifle and shovel by his body to make it appear as
if he were an insurgent planting a roadside bomb.

Local Iraqis are said to have told marine leaders about the alleged
shooting, which prompted an inquiry.

The accused were taken out of Iraq and held at Camp Pendleton in California.

A military spokesman said all were presumed innocent and it would be up to
the authorities to decide if the men would face the death penalty in any
future courts martial.

They have been identified as Sgt Lawrence Hutchins, Cpl Trent Thomas, Navy
Hospital Corpsman 3rd Class Melson Bacos, Lance Cpl Tyler Jackson, Pfc John
Jackson, Lance Cpl Jerry Shumate, Lance Cpl Robert Pennington and Cpl
Marshall Magincalda.

"The marine corps takes allegations of wrongdoing by its members very
seriously and is committed to thoroughly investigating such allegations,"
spokesman Col Stewart Navarre told reporters.

"The marine corps also prides itself on holding its members accountable for
their actions."

More charges

Correspondents say the Hamdaniya and Haditha cases have generated a huge
amount of unfavourable publicity for the marines and concern within the
corps about the conduct of some in Iraq.

Separately, the US military in Iraq announced that murder charges had been
filed against a fourth soldier following the shooting of three male Iraqi
prisoners near Tikrit in northern Iraq on 9 May.

The announcement came after three soldiers were charged on Monday with
premeditated murder in connection with the incident.

Another US inquiry has cleared marines of blame for the deaths of civilians
in Ishaqi in March.

Earlier this month the US military announced that US-led troops in Iraq were
to undergo 30 days of ethical training in the wake of the alleged massacre
in Haditha.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/5103558.stm

Published: 2006/06/22 13:19:43 GMT

© BBC MMVI

BAGHDAD, Iraq - The U.S. military has charged two soldiers in the February
killing of a civilian near Ramadi, the military said Sunday.

Spec. Nathan B. Lynn was charged with one count of voluntary manslaughter
for allegedly shooting an unarmed man on Feb. 15, the military said.

Lynn and Sgt. Milton Ortiz Jr., both of the 1st Battalion, 109th Infantry
(Mechanized) of the Pennsylvania National Guard, were each charged with one
count of obstructing justice for allegedly conspiring with another soldier
who allegedly put an AK-47 near the body of the man in an attempt to make it
look as though he was an insurgent.

Ortiz also was charged with one count of assault and one count of
communicating a threat for a separate incident on March 8, when he allegedly
placed an unloaded weapon against the head of an Iraqi man and threatened to
send him to prison, the military said.

Both soldiers are being held in Baghdad while awaiting Article 32 hearings
to determine if there is sufficient evidence to proceed to a court-martial.

Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may
not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.










#Salute to Iraq hero Chris

June 2006

Soldier awarded George cross for bravery under fire from our "" Allies"" the
Americans,



This story shows us how the British Military can turn a disaster caused by
the utter and total incompetence of the US military into something great and
good



IRAQ war hero Chris Finney - who won a rare George Cross when he was just
19 - has been promoted.

The Blues and Royals trooper earned his medal three years ago for saving a
comrade by dragging him from a burning tank while under fire.

Chris's bravery came during a friendly fire disaster as a US jet blitzed his
column of tanks in the invasion to topple Saddam in March 2003.

Now aged 21, he has impressed Top Brass so much he has been promoted to
Lance Corporal. Thank god for the professionalism and courage of our troops
when not only having to fight the enemy but avoid the Americans as well.



TIKRIT June 06

Four US soldiers have been charged with murder this week following the
shooting of three male Iraqi prisoners near Tikrit, Salahuddin province, in
northern Iraq on 9 May.

They have also been charged over allegations they threatened to kill a
fellow soldier if he spoke about the incident, the US military said.

The detainees died during a US military operation near the Thar Thar Canal
near Tikrit in northern Iraq on 9 May.

The probe was triggered by soldiers who raised suspicions about the deaths.

A criminal investigation began on 17 May and is continuing, the US military
said.



Just breaking on TV now, raping and murder the hallmark of the American
Military



US investigates new Iraq killings The US military has opened a criminal
investigation into the alleged killing of an Iraqi family in their home by
US soldiers, the US military says.

The investigation began on Saturday and follows an initial military inquiry.

An unnamed official told AP news agency one of the four victims, a woman,
was raped before being killed, and that five soldiers were under
investigation.

The probe is the latest in a series of inquiries into alleged abuse of
Iraqis by US troops.

The US Army's Criminal Investigation Command was asked to look into the
incident, which took place in the area of Mahmudiya, south of Baghdad, after
a preliminary military inquiry found reason to open a criminal probe, the
military said.

'Confined to base'

Little official detail has been revealed on the inquiry.

"The investigation just cracked open. We're just beginning to dig into the
details," said US military spokesman Major Todd Breasseale.











The anonymous official, described by AP as being close to the investigation,
said a soldier had admitted playing a role in the incident and been
arrested, and four others had been confined to base.

Last Thursday, seven marines and a sailor were charged with murder over the
death of a disabled Iraqi man in Hamdaniya in April.

Earlier in the week murder charges were filed against four soldiers over the
shooting of three male Iraqi prisoners near Tikrit in northern Iraq on 9
May.

Another Pentagon inquiry is looking into an alleged massacre at Haditha last
November, in which 24 civilians are thought to have been killed.

Correspondents say the Hamdaniya and Haditha cases have generated a huge
amount of unfavourable publicity for the marines and concern within the
corps about the conduct of some in Iraq.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/5134106.stm

Published: 2006/06/30 16:01:17 GMT

© BBC MMVI





Bombing 'killed Afghan civilians' A US-led bombing raid in southern
Afghanistan killed 10 civilians, an Afghan government inquiry has found.

Presidential spokesman Karim Rahimi told the BBC that 27 other civilians had
been hurt in last week's attack on a village in Uruzgan province.

He said about 50 Taleban fighters had been killed, including nine
commanders. Many of the civilians killed were women and children, he added.

There was no immediate response from coalition military officials.


The president has always said civilian casualties should be prevented
and has been urging coalition forces to be careful
Presidential spokesman Karim Rahimi






Civilians have been killed in a number of coalition bombing raids since the
Taleban were ousted in 2001.

The BBC's Bilal Sarwary says this latest incident puts President Hamid
Karzai in a difficult position because his repeated calls for the coalition
to take greater care appear to have had little effect.

British forces called in the bombing raids after fighting off a sustained
attack on a local government compound they were defending in the village of
Nawzad.

They said there was no evidence that civilians had been killed, and the
bombing raids were necessary because of the severity of the fighting with
the Taleban.

'Co-operation'

President Karzai ordered the investigation on Sunday, despatching a
fact-finding mission to the area near the Uruzgan capital, Tarin Kowt.

His spokesman said the special commission had concluded that three houses in
the village had been destroyed in the bombing.

One belonged to a local man, called Sher Jan, in whose house Taleban members
are said to have been meeting at the time of the air attack.

Coalition forces are thought to have acted on this intelligence in launching
the bombing raid.

Mr Rahimi said: "The house (of Sher Jan) was bombed by coalition forces.
About 50 Taleban were killed, including nine commanders.

"Unfortunately, 10 civilians were killed. Twenty-seven other people were
injured, among them children and elderly men and women.

"The president has always said civilian casualties should be prevented and
has been urging coalition forces to be careful."

The commission had recommended that coalition forces should co-operate
closely with Afghan forces, Mr Rahimi said.

It was also urging Afghans not to let the Taleban use their houses, mosques
or shrines "for terrorist activities", he added.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/south_asia/5201256.stm

Published: 2006/07/20 18:31:03 GMT

© BBC MMVI





US airman jailed over triple rape A US airman, who had been described as a
credit to his country's military, has been jailed for 12 years for raping
three "vulnerable" teenage girls.

Staff Sgt James Gardner, 34, got the 14, 15 and 17-year-olds drunk before
the assaults, York Crown Court heard.

He took advantage of the girls, who all lived in a North Yorkshire
children's home, while serving at the US base at RAF Menwith Hill, near
Harrogate.

He had denied five counts of rape, but was found guilty by a jury last
month.

Gardner was also found guilty of two counts of sexual assault and another of
attempted rape, following the trial in York.


You were motivated by lust and you set about getting them drunk and
then raping them when they were powerless to say yea or nay
Judge Paul Hoffman






He had claimed the teenagers consented to sex with him at his Harrogate
flat.

Judge Paul Hoffman made reference to Gardner's exemplary air force career,
saying he was "a credit to them".

But the judge went on: "You have lost all that, I'm afraid, by these
convictions.

"You took advantage of these young girls. You knew them to be vulnerable,
they lived in a children's home.

"You were motivated by lust and you set about getting them drunk and then
raping them when they were powerless to say yea or nay.

"The aggravating features here are the number of girls involved and the fact
that they were young."

Deported after release

Judge Hoffman said Gardner did not fit the criteria to be classified as
dangerous under the provisions of recent legislation, which would have meant
him being given an indeterminate sentence.

But the judge did order Gardner to be put on the sex offenders register for
life and to be deported after his release from prison, which he said would
probably be after serving half the 12 years.

The judge ordered separate sentences of four years and six years
respectively for the two sexual assaults to run concurrently with the 12
years for the five rapes and the attempted rape.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/england/north_yorkshire/5224410.stm

Published: 2006/07/28 17:58:11 GMT

© BBC MMVI



Canada divided as losses mount due to american friendly fire








Canadians are becoming used to the sight of coffins coming home from
Afghanistan.

Each grief-stricken ceremony, almost always accompanied by the mournful
sound of military bagpipes, is given extensive coverage by Canada's TV news.

On Sunday, four Canadian soldiers died in a major Nato-led anti-Taleban
campaign called Operation Medusa. They were killed during fierce fighting
with Taleban insurgents.

Then on Monday, another group of Canadian troops preparing to launch
operations from a temporary camp, found themselves strafed, without warning,
by two American A-10 Thunderbolt warplanes.

In the so-called "friendly-fire" incident, one of the Canadian soldiers died
and 30 more were injured, five of them seriously.



Dog-killing US serviceman jailed

A US serviceman who slashed his wife's pet dog's throat after she said she
was leaving has been jailed for 18 weeks.

Dustin Yandell, 21, killed the golden Labrador and dumped its body in a bin
outside his home in Newmarket, Suffolk.

At Bury St Edmunds Magistrates Court, Yandell, who is based at RAF
Lakenheath, in Suffolk, admitted causing unnecessary suffering to a dog.

RSPCA Chief Inspector Mark Thompson said the incident was "wanton cruelty"
and one of the worst cases he had seen.

'Deliberate cruelty'

The court heard the defendant told US Air Force investigators he acted after
getting upset at something his wife said during a telephone call.

Yandell's wife had returned to the US for the funeral of a friend and had
telephoned to say she was not returning.

After slitting its throat, he wrapped the dog's body in a bin liner and
placed it in a recycling bin outside his house, where it was found on 28
March by a dustman.

Mr Thompson said: "It's up at the top of the league as far as deliberate
cruelty goes.

"I have been doing this job for 20 years and I can only describe this as
wanton cruelty."

Magistrates' chairman Colin Reeve told Yandell that prison was the only
option because the offence was so serious.

Yandell was also banned from keeping animals for life.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/england/suffolk/5356320.stm

Published: 2006/09/18 11:34:02 GMT

© BBC MMVI



Marines charged over Iraq killing

Three US marines are to be tried by a military tribunal for the alleged
murder of an Iraqi civilian, the US military has said in a statement.

The three are among eight US personnel who have been charged with the kidnap
and murder of Hashim Ibrahim Awad, 52, in the village of Hamdaniya in April.

Prosecutors allege Mr Awad was kidnapped, dragged from his home with his
feet bound, and then shot.

Preliminary hearings of some defendants are expected in the coming weeks.

Pte John Jodka is accused of firing at the victim, Corp Marshall Magincalda
is accused of kidnap and binding the victim's feet, while L/Cpl Jerry
Shumate is alleged to have fired his rifle at him and to have lied to
investigators about what had happened.

The US statement said the death penalty would not be sought against any of
the three marines, although it is available in the case of premeditated
murder.

The shooting of Mr Awad is one of several killings in Iraq in which US
troops are accused of murdering Iraqi civilians.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/5380766.stm

Published: 2006/09/26 08:40:42 GMT

© BBC MMVI



US medic in Iraq kidnap plea deal

A US Navy medic has pleaded guilty to helping kidnap an Iraqi civilian in
Hamdaniya, while agreeing to testify about his comrades' roles in his death.

Petty Officer Melson J Bacos's plea bargain means he will not face murder
charges for the April killing.

Seven marines are at various stages of the military justice process over the
kidnap and murder of Hashim Awad.

The case is one of several in which US troops are accused of murdering
civilians in Iraq.

'Planting bomb'

According to charge documents presented to the military court, the troops
had entered the town near Baghdad searching for an insurgent.

Failing to find the suspect, the men are alleged to have grabbed Mr Awad
from his home and shot him.

It was further alleged that an assault rifle and a shovel were left by the
body, apparently to make it look like the man had been planting a roadside
bomb and had been killed in a gun battle.

Last month the US military said three marines would be tried for murder by a
military tribunal.

Pte John Jodka was accused of firing at the victim, Corp Marshall Magincalda
was accused of kidnap and binding the victim's feet, while L/Cpl Jerry
Shumate was alleged to have fired his rifle at him and to have lied to
investigators about what had happened.

The US statement said the death penalty would not be sought against any of
the three marines, although it was available in the case of premeditated
murder.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/5414396.stm

Published: 2006/10/06 16:56:33 GMT

© BBC MMVI



The ever lengthening list of utterly dishonourable and criminal behaviour
continues with the news from the UK that Eleven US Air Force personnel have
been arrested and charged with drug dealing from their airbase in the United
Kingdom. Daily Mail 8th Oct 2006



Iraq reporter unlawfully killed

A coroner has recorded a verdict of unlawful killing on ITN reporter Terry
Lloyd, who was shot dead by US forces in southern Iraq in March 2003.

An inquest heard Mr Lloyd was killed by a US bullet near Basra. His
interpreter died and his cameraman is missing.

It was told Mr Lloyd, 50 and originally from Derby, was hit while in a
makeshift ambulance, having already been hurt by American-Iraqi crossfire.

The coroner is to ask the attorney general to consider pressing charges.

Oxfordshire Assistant Deputy Coroner Andrew Walker said he would also be
writing to the director of public prosecutions asking for him to investigate
the possibility of bringing charges.

The Pentagon denied ever targeting non-combatants, including journalists.

'War crime'

Mr Lloyd's Lebanese interpreter, Hussein Osman, was also killed and French
cameraman Fred Nerac is still officially classed as missing, presumed dead.
Belgian cameraman Daniel Demoustier was the ITN crew's only survivor.

The National Union of Journalists (NUJ) said Mr Lloyd's killing was a "war
crime" and this was echoed by Mr Lloyd's widow, Lyn.


The ITN crew

Terry Lloyd, reporter - killed

Hussein Osman, interpreter - killed

Fred Nerac, cameraman - missing, presumed killed

Daniel Demoustier, cameraman - survived


In a statement she said: "This was a very serious war crime, how else can
firing on a vehicle in these circumstances be interpreted?

"This was not a friendly fire incident or a crossfire incident, it was a
despicable, deliberate, vengeful act, particularly as it came many minutes
after the initial exchange.

"US forces appear to have allowed their soldiers to behave like trigger
happy cowboys in an area where civilians were moving around."

A spokesman for the US Department of Defense said: "An investigation into
the circumstances surrounding the incident was completed in May 2003.

"The investigation was limited to the engagement of the vehicle Mr Lloyd was
traveling in. The investigation determined that US forces followed the
applicable Rules of Engagement

'We do not target non-combatants'

"The Department of Defense has never deliberately targeted non-combatants,
including journalists. We have always gone to extreme measures to avoid
civilian casualties and collateral damage.

"It has been an unfortunate reality that journalists have died in Iraq.
Combat operations are inherently dangerous and we do not take lightly our
responsibilities in the conduct of these operations. We do not, nor would we
ever, deliberately target a non-combatant civilian or journalist."

His daughter Chelsey said: "The killing of my father would seem to amount to
murder, which is deeply shocking."

ITN praised

Mr Lloyd was covering the British and American invasion of Iraq as a
"unilateral" journalist, rather than those "embedded" with UK or US forces,
who were subject to military censorship.

He and his three colleagues were caught up in a firefight between US and
Iraqi forces near the Shatt Al Basra Bridge on 22 March 2003.

After an eight-day inquest Mr Walker cleared ITN of any blame for Mr Lloyd's
death and praised him and his team for their "professionalism and
dedication".

He said it was his view the American tanks had been first to open fire on
the ITN crew's two vehicles.

He added Mr Lloyd would probably have survived the first bullet wound he
received, but was killed as he travelled away in a makeshift ambulance.

Mr Walker said it "presented no threat to American forces" since it was a
civilian minibus and was facing away from the US tanks.


The killing of my father would seem to amount to murder, which is
deeply shocking
Chelsey Lloyd


"I have no doubt it was the fact that the vehicle stopped to pick up
survivors that prompted the Americans to fire on that vehicle," he said.

ITN's editor in chief David Mannion said: "I would also like to say
something that I know Terry would have wished me to say.

"Independent, unilateral reporting, free from official strictures, is
crucial; not simply to us as journalists but to the role we play in a free
and democratic society."

Mr Nerac's widow Fabienne said she would continue her "lonely vigil" to find
out what happened to her husband.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/uk/6046950.stm

Published: 2006/10/13 12:37:25 GMT

© BBC MMVI


http://armytimes.com/story.php?f=1-292925-2332557.php
November 03, 2006

Alleged fragger defers entering plea

By Gina Cavallaro
Staff writer

Staff Sgt. Alberto B. Martinez, who is charged with premeditated murder
in the deaths of two officers last year in Iraq, deferred entering a
plea at his arraignment Friday at Fort Bragg, N.C.

The military judge, Col. Patrick Parrish, granted the request, then set
the first pre-trial motion hearing date for April 16, 2007, and the
opening arguments for the court-martial to begin on June 4, 2007,
according to an Army press release.

The military judge said the panel will be selected prior to June 4, but
set no date for that selection.

Deferring a plea "gives the defense additional time to decide what
their pleas are going to be," said Neal Puckett, a former Marine and
practicing military attorney who's not associated with the Martinez
case. "They're not required to enter a plea at this time."

Martinez is alleged to have killed Capt. Phillip T. Esposito, 30, and
1st Lt. Louis E. Allen, 34, of Headquarters and Headquarters Company of
the New York National Guard's 42nd Infantry Division.

The officers were mortally wounded around 10 p.m., June 7, 2005, by
what officials first believed was an enemy indirect fire attack at
Forward Operating Base Danger, about 80 miles north of Baghdad.

They had been working in the company's first floor office at a building
known as the Water Palace when the explosions occurred. Both died of
their wounds the following day at FOB Speicher outside Tikrit.

Martinez, who was a supply sergeant in the same company, was charged
June 15, 2005, with two specifications of premeditated murder in their
deaths.

Lt. Gen. John R. Vines, the General Court Martial Convening Authority,
referred the charges to General Court Martial on September 27, 2006, as
a capital case.

Martinez is also charged with wrongful possession of a privately owned
firearm, wrongful possession of unexploded ordnance, and wrongful
possession of alcohol, all of which were violations of 42nd ID General
Order No. 1.

Charges also include violation of Article 108 - sale, loss, damage,
destruction, or wrongful disposition of military property of the United
States; and he is charged with one specification of wrongful
disposition of government property by giving printers and copiers to an
Iraqi national. At the 45-minute hearing, Parrish explained Martinez's
rights to him and identified the attorneys representing both the
government and the defense. When asked by the military judge, Martinez
agreed to be represented by the two military attorneys previously
appointed to him.

Parrish then advised Martinez that he was entitled to have the case
heard by a panel composed of a minimum of 12 military members, and that
he could elect that it be composed of either all officers, or of
officers and at least one third enlisted members senior to him in rank.





US serviceman admits Iraq charges

A third US serviceman has pleaded guilty to charges related to the murder of
an Iraqi civilian.

Marine Lance Corporal Tyler Jackson, 23, told a military court that his unit
deliberately targeted Hashim Ibrahim Awad, believing he was an insurgent.

Eight US personnel were initially accused of murdering Mr Awad.

But another marine and a navy serviceman have already pleaded guilty to
lesser charges. Five others have yet to stand trial.

L/Cpl Jackson pleaded guilty to reduced charges of aggravated assault and
conspiracy to obstruct justice, in return for his co-operation.

He is due to be sentenced on 16 November. He faces a maximum of 15 years in
jail, although the sentence is expected to be reduced because of his plea
deal.

Rounds fired

The eight US personnel are accused of taking their 52-year-old disabled
victim from his home in Hamdaniya, near Baghdad, and shooting him dead.

The accused are also alleged to have covered up the circumstances of his
death.

In his testimony, L/Cpl Jackson said his squad had believed Mr Awad was
responsible for planting roadside bombs, including one which killed four
marines.

He said he had agreed with the plan to kill Mr Awad.

"Everyone fired rounds, including myself, but I fired my rounds above him. I
knew he was going to be shot, but I didn't want to be the one to do so,"
L/Cpl Jackson said.

It was only later that they realised they had grabbed the wrong man, the
court heard.

The accused were taken out of Iraq and held at Camp Pendleton in California
after local Iraqis reportedly told marine leaders about the alleged
incident.

The shooting of Mr Awad is one of several killings in Iraq in which US
troops are accused of murdering Iraqi civilians.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/6123858.stm

Published: 2006/11/07 13:48:27 GMT

© BBC MMVI





US soldier admits Iraq girl rape







A US Army soldier has pleaded guilty to raping a 14-year-old Iraqi girl and
helping murder her and her family.

James Barker agreed to the plea deal at the start of his court-martial in
the US to avoid the death penalty, his civilian lawyer said.

A criminal investigation began in June into the killing of the family of
four in their home in Mahmudiya, south of Baghdad, in March 2006.

Specialist Barker is one of four US soldiers charged with murder.

They are alleged to have helped a former private - who has since been
discharged from the army - to plan, carry out and cover up the attack.

Two of the soldiers could face the death penalty if found guilty.

All four soldiers belong to the 2nd Brigade of the elite 101st Airborne
Division.

Separate trial

Specialist Barker had agreed to co-operate with prosecutors and will testify
against the others, his civilian lawyer, David Sheldon, said.

The others charged with rape and murder were Pte Jesse Spielman, Sgt Paul
Cortez, and Pte Bryan Howard.

In addition, former soldier Steven Green has been charged in a civilian
court and is awaiting trial in a Kentucky jail.

He was discharged from the army for a personality disorder earlier this
year, and in July pleaded not guilty to charged of murder and sexual
assault.

Later on Wednesday, a military court in California is due to hand down a
sentence to a private who admitted to involvement in the death of an Iraqi
civilian near the town of Hamdaniya last April.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/6152118.stm

Published: 2006/11/15 18:55:16 GMT

© BBC MMVI



US marine jailed for Iraq death

By David Willis
BBC News, Camp Pendleton, California






A US marine has received an 18-month prison sentence for his part in killing
an unarmed man in Iraq.

Pte John Jodka is one of eight servicemen implicated in the attack seven
months ago in Hamdania, in which a 52-year-old man died.

The judge said he would have sentenced Jodka to five years, but he was bound
by a "very fortuitous" pre-trial deal.

Jodka, who apologised to the victim's family, is expected to give evidence
against the other defendants.

They are expected to face murder charges, and they could face the death
penalty if convicted.

By giving evidence against them, Pte Jodka stands to receive a general
discharge from the marines, although the judge, Lt Col David Jones, said
that he would have given him a dishonourable discharge.

Disabled grandfather

At 20 years of age, Pte Jodka is the youngest and lowest-ranking member of a
group of marines who were deployed in Iraq earlier this year.

It is alleged that the eight-strong team went looking for a suspected
insurgent.

When they failed to find him the men became frustrated and dragged a
disabled grandfather from his home, bound and beat him and then shot him to
death.

In court, Pte Jodka apologised to the family of the Iraqi man who died and
to fellow members of the Marine corps.

He also talked about conditions in Iraq, referring to the fear and
frustration he and his colleagues felt there and telling the court that he
often felt poorly trained for the duties he had been asked to undertake,
including counter-terrorism.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/6152636.stm

Published: 2006/11/16 02:29:20 GMT

© BBC MMVI



Prison for marine over Iraq death

A US marine has become the third serviceman to be sentenced for his part in
killing a 52-year-old man in Iraq.

Lance Cpl Tyler Jackson, 23, received a 21-month prison sentence after
pleading guilty to reduced charges and agreeing to testify against fellow
soldiers.

He is one of eight to be implicated in the attack seven months ago in
Hamdaniya in which an unarmed man died.

A Navy medic, Melson Bacos, and marine John Jodka have already been jailed
for a year and for 18 months respectively.

The terms of their sentences were reduced because they had made pre-trial
agreements.

Similarly, in Jackson's case military judge Lt Col Joseph Lisiecki sentenced
the marine to nine years in jail, but a deal with prosecutors meant the
actual term was limited to 21 months, of which he has already served six.

Public disquiet

Speaking at the hearing, held at Camp Pendleton, California, Jackson
expressed regret for his failure to prevent the killing.







"I wish I'd had the courage to prevent his death," he said. His defence
lawyer said he had been led astray.

The BBC's David Willis, in California, says other more senior officers among
the defendants are expected to face kidnapping and murder charges.

They could face the death penalty if convicted in trials that are likely to
drag on towards the end of 2007, our correspondent says.

It is alleged that the eight-strong team went looking for a suspected
insurgent.

When they failed to find him the men became frustrated and dragged a
disabled grandfather from his home, bound and beat him and then shot dead.

The case comes on the heels of the US mid-term elections, where Iraq
featured as a key issue for voters.

Our correspondent says the case will feed into public disquiet about the
conduct of the war in Iraq.

In another high profile case, US soldiers are facing the prospect of
prosecution over the deaths of 24 Iraqis at Haditha in November 2005.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/6156828.stm

Published: 2006/11/17 03:22:24 GMT

© BBC MMVI







US marine given 40 years for rape

A US marine has been sentenced to 40 years in prison for raping a local
woman in the Philippines last year.

The sentence was handed down to Lance Corporal Daniel Smith in a Manila
courtroom for the rape of the woman in a van at a former US navy base.

Three other defendants, Lance Corporals Keith Silkwood and Dominic Duplantis
and Staff Sergeant Chad Carpentier, were all cleared of rape.

The case had sparked strong protests from women's and left-wing groups.

About 100 protesters were outside the courthouse for the verdict.

They sang the nationalist song My Country and called for the end of the
Visiting Forces Agreement that covers the use of overseas troops in training
exercises.

Damages

The attack took place at the former US naval base of Subic Bay, west of
Manila, in November last year.

Smith, 21, from St Louis, Missouri, had said the sex was consensual.

But Judge Benjamin Pozon said the woman was so drunk she could not have
consented to sex.

He said the length of the sentence was aimed at "protecting women against
the unbridled bestiality of persons who cannot control their libidinous
proclivity".

Smith was also ordered to pay the defendant 100,000 pesos ($2,000) in
damages.

The marines had been held in custody at the US embassy, after the US refused
to hand them over until the end of the trial.

The defendants were stationed in Okinawa, Japan, but had just finished
manoeuvres in the Philippines when the attack occurred.

The case created strong emotions in the Philippines, with protesters often
appearing at the courtroom.

They had held placards including the phrases "Justice for Nicole," "Jail the
Yankees," and "Rage Against Rape".

Nicole was the pseudonym given to the victim, now 23, in the case.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6205324.stm

Published: 2006/12/04 07:39:13 GMT

© BBC MMVI





Yanks Kill another Brit marine 8 Dec 2006

The British commando killed in Afghanistan this week died when hit by
"friendly fire" from an American plane, Royal Marines who fought beside him
claimed on Thursday.

In chilling detail that provides a stark insight into the dangers faced by
British troops, they told how Jonathan Wigley was killed as a result of
support fire from a US A-10 tankbuster called in to help the Marines during
a ferocious 10-hour battle with Tailban gunmen on Monday.

Marine Wigley, of Zulu Company 45 Commando suffered massive chest wounds and
was flown by helicopter to hospital at Camp Bastion where he died. A second
Marine, who has not been named, was also seriously injured.

One British soldier who was five feet from the 21-year-old Wigley
specifically identified the fatal fire as coming from an A-10. Other British
soldiers backed his claims.

"I saw it," said the soldier, who cannot be named because he is not
officially allowed to speak about the death while it is still under
investigation.

"It was the A-10. I was five feet away," he said. "We called in a strike on
the next trench. Then I saw it swooping toward us. I will never forget that
noise. It was horrible."

He told how Marines had launched a desperate battle to save their comrade.

"We kept going for 20 minutes, but he had stopped breathing," said the
soldier, his hands making gestures as if still pounding on his fallen
comrade's chest to keep him alive.

He also tended to another Marine hit in the same strike, wrapping a
tourniquet around his arm to stop it bleeding. All the while, they continued
to take enemy fire. "I threw myself on top of him to stop him getting hit,"
said the soldier.

A British armoured ambulance from C Squadron, the Light Dragoons, drove
through mortar fire to reach the fallen men and ferry them to a helicopter.

Medical crew described a harrowing ride under fire over ditches as they
fought to revive him while the other wounded marine writhed in pain from his
shattered arm.

The remaining troops finally withdrew, forced to blast their way through
walls to escape from mud-brick housing compounds as Taliban tried to
encircle them, the soldier said.

The soldier, a demolitions expert, said he used up nearly an entire rucksack
of explosives to create an escape route.

"We blew down one wall, the blast knocked us back five feet," he said.

Eventually they succeeded in withdrawing before nightfall, hiding behind
armoured vehicles which they used as cover.

Last night as an investigation probed the death of the 41st British soldier
to die in Afghanistan since the 2001 operation to topple the Taliban,
Lieutenant-Colonel Andy Price said : "It is possible, but not confirmed,
that Marine Wigley's death may have been the result of fire from ISAF
aircraft operating in support.

"This had been a protracted engagement, and the fatal injuries were received
at a time when ISAF aircraft were engaging Taliban forces in very close
proximity to Marine Wigley's position."

The dead soldier was part of a Marine commando force that swept into wheat
fields south of a bridgehead in the village of Garmser, provoking the
biggest battle in the southern part of Helmand since British troops arrived
in the province earlier this year.

The Marine, from Melton Mowbray, Leicestershire, was hit about midday as the
Islamist militants launched an unexpectedly fierce counter-attack and the
British forces called in air strikes from helicopters, and F-18 and A-10
fixed-wing planes. Giant B1 bombers also dropped 500lb bombs.

Apache attack helicopters flown by British pilots took part in the support
operation pounding Taliban position in addition to the A-10 and F-18
fixed-wing planes with American pilots.

The operation was aimed at driving Taliban from the village they had been
using to launch attacks on British and NATO forces but it was the Marines
who withdrew after fighters launched their counter-attack from underground
bunkers.

Friendly-fire deaths are not unusual in Afghanistan. Such incidents have
become a problem for NATO forces since guerrillas often move close into NATO
positions, making it difficult for aircraft to engage them without hitting
allied troops.

Canadian, U.S. and Afghan forces have previously lost men because of
misguided fire. But this is believed to be the first such British death in
Afghanistan.

During the 2003 war to topple Saddam Hussein in Iraq, British forces
suffered at least three "friendly fire" tragedies with the deaths of two
British soldiers resulting from A-10 attacks which hit armoured vehicles.

It was fire from two American A-10 pilots that killed nine British soldiers
from the Royal Fusiliers in the worst "blue-on-blue" tragedy in the 1991
Gulf War that drove Saddam's forces from Kuwait.

The British spokesman Lieut-Col. Price said that, even if friendly strikes
were found to have killed Wigley, "there is no question that close air
support also saved the lives of many of our men that day".

Marine Wigley, who joined the British Forces as a 17-year-old, was the 515th
member of the NATO and Coalition forces to die in Afghanistan since 2001.

The village of Garmser has frequently been the scene of intense and heroic
fighting which is said to have been the the fiercest since the Korean War.

In one episode, British soldiers defended a strategic town in a heroic
action compared to the battle of Rorke's Drift, when 150 British soldiers
held off 4,000 Zulu warriors for two days in January 1879.

British, American and Dutch aircraft have dropped hundreds of bombs on enemy
positions around the village, often in the middle of frantic firefights with
friendly forces in grave danger of being overrun.

The Taliban fighters have no protection against the coalition's devastating
airpower but often adopt the deliberate tactic of fighting British forces
from as close range as possible, making it extremely difficult for pilots
circling overhead to pick out enemy positions and fire rockets or drop bombs
safely without risk of hitting their own side.

A 1,000lb bomb has a killing radius of up to 800 yards, but in Helmand
British and U.S. pilots have frequently had to drop such weapons little more
than 100 yards from their own desperate troops - while flying at 20,000ft or
more to avoid ground fire.

Commanders believe successful actions over the summer by British soldiers
defending towns in northern Helmand, and recent ceasefire deals struck by
tribal elders, have pushed Taliban forces further south.

The death of the Marine came two days after British soldiers were accused of
shooting civilians in Afhganistan following a suicide bombing that injured
three commandos.



US sub collides with Japan ship

A US nuclear-powered submarine has collided with a Japanese tanker near the
Straits of Hormuz, Japanese and US government officials have said.

The USS Newport News did not suffer substantial damage, and there were no
injuries to crew, a US Navy spokeswoman told the AFP news agency.

There were no oil spills from Japanese tanker, the Mogamigawa, and no
injuries, a company official said.

The tanker will dock in the United Arab Emirates to check the damage.

The bow of the submarine collided with the stern of the oil tanker at
1915GMT just outside the busy shipping lanes of the Straits of Hormuz.

The Mogamigawa is operated by Kawasaki Kisen Ltd, the Kyodo news agency
reported.

Japanese oil company Showa Shell Sekiyu K.K. told the agency the ship was en
route from the Gulf to Singapore with a crew of eight Japanese and 16
Filipinos.

A US Navy spokesman in Bahrain said that there had been a collision.

"I can confirm that an incident took place between one of our submarines and
a merchant ship," said Commander Kevin Aandahl of the US Fifth Fleet.

The 110-metre (360-foot) USS Newport News carries a crew of 127.

The BBC's Chris Hogg, in Tokyo, says there will be embarrassment for the US
navy over the incident but also relief that the collision was not more
serious.

In February 2001, the US nuclear submarine Greenville sank a Japanese
fisheries training vessel, the Ehime Maru, off Hawaii, killing nine sailors
on the fishing boat.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/6243395.stm

Published: 2007/01/09 06:29:46 GMT

© BBC MMVII



Spain seeks US soldiers' arrest

Spain has issued an international arrest warrant for three US soldiers
accused of causing the death of a TV cameraman during the Iraq war.

Jose Couso, 37, died in April 2003 after a US tank fired on a hotel used by
foreign journalists in Baghdad.

The US has admitted its tank crew fired at the Palestine Hotel but has
cleared Sgt Thomas Gibson, Cpt Philip Wolford and Lt-Col Philip De Camp of
blame.

The soldiers say they thought they were being shot at when they opened fire.

Caught on film

The Palestine Hotel was the base for almost all the foreign media crews in
Baghdad during the US-led invasion of Iraq. Mr Couso was working for Spain's
Telecinco television station at the time.

Reuters cameraman Taras Portsyuk, a Ukrainian, was also killed in the blast
and three other Reuters staff injured.

Footage of the incident on the day before the fall of the regime of Iraqi
leader Saddam Hussein - which did not record any fire from the hotel - was
witnessed around the world.

A US review of the incident ruled that the use of force by the tank was
justified, but the family of Mr Couso decided to press criminal charges
through the Spanish courts.

Freeze on assets

In December 2006, Spain's supreme court overturned a previous high court
decision and ruled that the Spanish legal system was competent to judge the
three US soldiers.'

As he issued the international search-and-capture order for the three tank
crew members, Judge Santiago Pedraz demanded that prosecutors also
investigate whether it was possible to freeze the soldiers' US assets in
case of future compensation claims.

The BBC's Danny Wood in Madrid says Spain's justice system is accustomed to
taking on controversial international cases.

In 1998, Spain attempted to extradite Chile's former leader, Augusto
Pinochet, while he was in London.

The British government turned down that request, and the US authorities are
very unlikely to co-operate with this latest international arrest warrant
issued by a Spanish judge, our correspondent says.

But four years after the death of Mr Couso, his family have achieved a
symbolic victory, he says.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/europe/6268461.stm

Published: 2007/01/16 18:51:39 GMT

© BBC MMVII





'Friendly fire' death in Pakistan

Pakistan says US-led coalition forces in Afghanistan have mistakenly killed
one of its soldiers at a border post.

Two other soldiers were wounded when coalition forces opened fire in the
Shawal area of North Waziristan region, a Pakistan military statement said.

It said a "strong protest" had been lodged with the coalition, which said it
was investigating the incident.

Earlier, at least three Pakistani security personnel were killed in a
roadside bombing in North Waziristan.

'Inside Afghanistan'

The BBC's Haroon Rashid in Peshawar says coalition forces have in the past
violated Pakistani air space, but this would be the first time Pakistani
troops have been killed.


I cannot confirm or deny loss or injury of Pakistani military
Paul Fitzpatrick,
US military spokesman


Early last year US planes bombed three compounds in the Bajaur tribal
region, killing at least 13 people. Pakistan protested then too.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/south_asia/6288023.stm

Published: 2007/01/22 16:40:30 GMT

© BBC MMVII



US soldier jailed for Iraq deaths

A US soldier has been jailed for 18 years after pleading guilty to murdering
three Iraqi detainees.

Pte Corey Clagett, 21, who is the third soldier to plead guilty in
connection with the case, made the plea in a deal with military prosecutors.

The deaths happened near Tikrit in northern Iraq on 9 May 2006.

A fourth soldier from the 101st Airborne Division, squad leader Staff Sgt
Raymond Girouard, is due to face court-martial in the coming months.

Under the deal, Clagett admitted charges of murder, attempted murder,
conspiracy to commit murder and conspiracy to obstruct justice.

Earlier this month another member of the group, Specialist William Hunsaker,
was jailed for 18 years after pleading guilty to murder.

Another soldier has admitted aggravated assault with a dangerous weapon.

The men initially told prosecutors that they shot the detainees because they
were trying to escape.

But during his trial, Hunsaker testified that Sgt Girouard gave an order to
kill them.

"He told us to cut the zip ties, tell them to run and shoot them. I went out
and did just that," he told the court.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/6299975.stm

Published: 2007/01/25 20:18:52 GMT

© BBC MMVII



Five charged over US Iraq 'scam'

A US court has charged three reserve army officers and two civilians with
using millions of dollars of Iraq reconstruction money for personal gain.

The group are accused of directing at least $8m (£4m) to a construction firm
run by a US businessman in return for luxuries such as cars and jewellery.

The officers were responsible for supervising how some $26bn was spent on
reconstruction projects in Iraq.

One man has already been jailed and another awaits sentence over the scam.

Cash and jewellery

According to the 25-count indictment, Col Curtis G Whiteford, Lt Col Debra M
Harrison and Lt Col Michael B Wheeler channelled the funds into a
construction and services company operated by US businessman Philip H Bloom.

US citizen Michael Morris is alleged to have acted as a go-between,
illegally wiring money and securing the goods.


This indictment alleges that the defendants flagrantly enriched
themselves at the expense of the Iraqi people
Paul J McNulty
US deputy attorney general


Mr Morris was arrested in Romania, from where the US is seeking to extradite
him back to New Jersey.

The other indicted civilian, William Driver, is Col Harrison's husband.

The group is alleged to have run the scam for two years, from December 2003
when Iraq was governed by the Coalition Provisional Authority (CPA)
following the overthrow of Saddam Hussein.

The officers are alleged to have rigged contracts being awarded by the CPA
so they were won by Bloom's company.

In return, Bloom is alleged to have furnished the group and others with over
$1m in cash, vehicles, jewellery, computers, business class airline tickets,
alcohol and promises of employment.

Mr Driver is charged with helping to smuggle at least $10,000 into the US to
help pay for home improvements.

"This indictment alleges that the defendants flagrantly enriched themselves
at the expense of the Iraqi people - the very people they were there to
help," said Deputy Attorney General Paul J McNulty.

"US government officials working in Iraq are not for sale," he said.

Last week former Pentagon contractor Robert Stein was jailed for nine years
after pleading guilty to the scam.

Bloom has also pleaded guilty and is awaiting sentence.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/6340717.stm

Published: 2007/02/07 22:22:27 GMT

© BBC MMVII





US soldier on Italy murder charge

An Italian judge has ordered a US soldier to face trial over the death of an
Italian intelligence agent in a car at a checkpoint in Baghdad.

Nicola Calipari, 51, was shot in March 2005 as he escorted Italian
journalist Giuliana Sgrena to the airport after securing her release from
kidnappers.

The soldier, Mario Lozano, will face a charge of murder in a case that put
serious strain on US-Italian relations.

He will probably be tried in absentia as he has been cleared in the US.

'First step'

Spc Lozano, of the New York-based 69th Infantry Regiment, is indicted for
murder and attempted murder.

A second Italian agent, who was driving the car, and Ms Sgrena were wounded.


DIFFERING ACCOUNTS

US military : Car approaches checkpoint at high speed

Troops attempt to tell driver to stop with arm signals, lights and
warning shots

Soldiers shoot into engine

Italian government : No warning signs to motorists about impending
checkpoint

Car not speeding and did not accelerate after warning shots

Proper inquiry impossible because vehicles removed and army logs
destroyed just after shooting






Mr Calipari's widow, Rosa, said: "This looks to me like the first step on a
long road toward truth and justice, and I hope justice will come in the
end."

Ms Sgrena said: "We don't want to make Mario Lozano the scapegoat, but we
want to find out who was responsible and have justice."

The Italian lawyer for Spc Lozano expressed surprise at the ruling:
"[Lozano] was carrying out his duty, which is something that the judge did
not consider relevant."

The trial has been set for 17 April.

The US and Italy drew widely differing conclusions in their investigations
into the case, particularly over the speed of the car.

Mr Calipari was mourned as a national hero in Italy.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/europe/6339021.stm

Published: 2007/02/07 15:09:46 GMT

© BBC MMVII





US 'erased Afghan attack footage'

The Associated Press is to complain to the US military after journalists
said US soldiers deleted footage of the aftermath of an attack in
Afghanistan.

President Hamid Karzai said 10 people died when coalition forces opened fire
on civilians after a suicide attack in eastern Nangarhar province on Sunday.

Journalists working for AP said US troops erased images of a vehicle in
which three people had been shot dead.

The US military said it could not confirm its troops had seized any film.

'Co-ordinated attack'

The Americans say the fighting started when a convoy of marines was attacked
by a suicide bomber and came under co-ordinated small-arms fire.


Two soldiers with a translator came and said, 'Why are you taking
pictures? You don't have permission'
Photographer Rahmat Gul


They say their soldiers returned fire, and acknowledge that at least eight
Afghan civilians were killed, with a further 35 injured.

Thousands of local people took to the streets on Sunday to protest against
what happened. The Afghan authorities have launched an investigation into
the circumstances of the militant attack.

'You will face problems'

In a report from Kabul, the Associated Press (AP) said it "plans to lodge a
protest with the American military".

A freelance photographer working for AP and a cameraman working for AP
Television News say they arrived at the site about half an hour after the
suicide bombing.

Witnesses at the scene said three civilians in the four-wheel drive vehicle
had been killed by US forces fleeing the attack, the journalists said.

"When I went near the four-wheel drive, I saw the Americans taking pictures
of the same car, so I started taking pictures," photographer Rahmat Gul
said.

"Two soldiers with a translator came and said, 'Why are you taking pictures?
You don't have permission.'"

Mr Gul said troops took his camera, deleted his photos and returned it to
him.

His APTN colleague, who did not want to be named, said he was told he could
film the scene - but when he did so a US soldier got very angry and deleted
any footage that included the Americans.

Khanwali Kamran, a reporter for the Afghan channel Ariana Television, said
the American soldiers also deleted his footage, AP reported.

"They warned me that if it is aired ... then, 'You will face problems,'" Mr
Kamran was quoted by the news agency as saying.

Reporters Without Borders condemned the alleged actions of the US forces,
saying they dealt with the media poorly.

"Why did the soldiers do it if they don't have anything to hide?" said
Jean-Francois Julliard, a spokesman for the Paris-based group.

US military spokesman Lt Col David Accetta said he did not have any
confirmed reports that coalition forces "have been involved in confiscating
cameras or deleting images".

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/south_asia/6419235.stm

Published: 2007/03/05 12:20:22 GMT

© BBC MMVII



US soldier in Iraq murder trial

The last of four US soldiers has gone on trial for his part in the murder of
three Iraqi detainees on 9 May 2006.

Sgt Raymond Girouard, 24, is the most senior soldier to face a court-martial
for the killings during a raid on a suspected insurgent camp near Samarra.

He denies ordering his soldiers to shoot the Iraqi prisoners, but admits his
role in covering up the deaths.

Two soldiers have pleaded guilty to murder and were jailed for 18 years.
Another was sentenced to nine months.

Specialist William Hunsaker and Private First Class Corey Clagett - who
admitted to releasing and then shooting the men - received 18-year sentences
in a deal with military prosecutors.

Specialist Juston Graber - who said he killed an injured prisoner in what he
called a mercy killing - admitted aggravated assault and was jailed for nine
months.

'Cover-up'

Hunsaker testified on Tuesday that Sgt Girouard gave him orders to free the
three Iraqi detainees, and then shoot them as they fled.

Hunsaker said that after the squad took the detainees into custody, Sgt
Girouard told the soldiers the group's first sergeant was angry the three
men were still alive.

Hunsaker said he and Corey Clagett took the detainees outside and told them
to run.

"I shot him [the first detainee] where his heart should be. I moved from
right to left. I took aim in the same manner and aimed for the heart and the
head," Hunsaker told the court.

He said that after the detainees were shot, Sgt Girouard cut him with a
pocket knife to make it appear there had been a struggle.

Sgt Girouard's lawyer, Anita Gorecki, said in her opening statement that Sgt
Girouard did not order his soldiers to shoot the Iraqi detainees, but that
he did help cover up the deaths.

"He saw what they did. He realised they killed the detainees, and in that
moment, yes, he decided to help his squad members," Ms Gorecki told the
military court.

The case is one of two incidents involving allegations of civilian killings
involving the 101st Airborne Division.

In the other case, four soldiers and a former soldier are accused of raping
and murdering a 14-year-old girl in March 2006, and killing her family.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/americas/6448281.stm

Published: 2007/03/13 22:55:26 GMT

© BBC MMVII



US 'excessive' in Afghan attack

US marines violated international humanitarian law by using excessive
violence in reaction to a suicide bomb attack in Afghanistan, a report says.

The reaction was disproportionate and indiscriminate force used, it said.

At least 12 civilians died and 35 were injured during the incident which
took place on 4 March in Nangarhar province.

A preliminary US investigation agreed with the report that the unit did not
come under small-arms fire after the bombing, US media reports said.

Maj Gen Frank H Kearney III, who ordered the inquiry, told the Washington
Post newspaper it had found no evidence that the victims were fighters.

"My investigating officer believes these folks were innocent," he was quoted
as saying.

A US military spokesman said shortly after the incident that the civilians
might have been killed by incoming fire from an ambush by insurgents which
followed the bombing.

Deleted footage

The Afghan report said that, in failing to distinguish between civilian and
legitimate military targets, the US marine corps used "indiscriminate
force".


We have testimony from marines that is in conflict with unanimous
testimony from civilians at the site
Maj-Gen Frank H Kearney III
Head of US inquiry


"Their actions thus constitute a serious violation of international
humanitarian law standards," it said.

Evidence of a complex ambush involving militant gunmen who fired on the
convoy was "far from conclusive", the report said.

According to the authors of the report, who spoke to victims, police and
hospital officials as well as eyewitnesses, the marines fired
indiscriminately on civilians and their vehicles as they left the scene.

Meanwhile Maj Gen Kearney said no ammunition casings had been found that
might substantiate reports that the marines were fired on.

"We found ... no brass that we can confirm that small-arms fire came at
them," he told the Washington Post.

"We have testimony from marines that is in conflict with unanimous testimony
from civilians at the site."

Journalists said US soldiers deleted footage, including photos and videos,
showing the aftermath of the Nangarhar violence.

The soldiers were moved out of Afghanistan after the incident.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/south_asia/6556721.stm

Published: 2007/04/15 06:48:25 GMT

© BBC MMVII



Marine urinated on Haditha victim

A US marine angered by the death of a comrade urinated on one of the 24
Iraqi civilians killed by his unit in Haditha in 2005, he admitted on
Wednesday.

Sgt Sanick Dela Cruz also said his squad leader shot five of the Iraqis as
they stood with their hands in the air.

Sgt Dela Cruz was speaking at a hearing for one of the four officers charged
with dereliction of duty for failing to investigate the killings.

Three other marines have been charged with second-degree murder.

Iraqi witnesses say the shootings were in retaliation for a roadside bomb
that had killed Lance Cpl Miguel Terrazas as his convoy drove through
Haditha, 240km (150 miles) north-west of Baghdad, on 19 November 2005.

'Bad thing'

Sgt Dela Cruz told the military courtroom at Camp Pendleton in California of
the distress he felt after discovering the explosion had ripped Lance Cpl
Terrazas, known as TJ, in half.







"I know it was a bad thing what I've done, but I done it because I was angry
TJ was dead and I pissed on one Iraqi's head," he said.

He also testified that after the explosion Staff Sgt Frank Wuterich had shot
dead five men as they stood by a white car with the hands in the air.

"They were just standing, looking around, had hands up," he said.

"Then I saw one of them drop in the middle."

"Looked to my left, saw Sgt Wuterich shooting."

Afterwards Sgt Dela Cruz said he himself had "sprayed" the bodies with
gunfire.

"I knew they were dead, I wanted to make sure," he explained.

Immunity

Sgt Wuterich then shot each of the men in the upper body and head, Sgt Dela
Cruz testified.


He told me that if anybody asked, [we should say] they were running
away and the Iraqi army shot them
Sgt Sanick Dela Cruz


"He went to every single one of them, sir, and shot them," he added.

"He told me that if anybody asked, they were running away and the Iraqi army
shot them."

Sgt Wuterich's lawyer, Neal Puckett, said Sgt Dela Cruz's account was
"false" and that he had told investigators up to five different versions of
the events.

"It's unfortunate that in exchange for his freedom he's being forced to
testify against his brothers," Mr Puckett told the Associated Press.

In April, the Marine Corps dropped all charges against Sgt Dela Cruz and
granted immunity in exchange for his testimony.

If found guilty, the three marines charged with second-degree murder could
face life imprisonment.

The Haditha inquiry is just one of a number the US military has been
conducting into incidents of alleged unlawful killings by US forces in Iraq.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/6641843.stm

Published: 2007/05/10 10:23:35 GMT

© BBC MMVII



US attack 'kills Iraqi children'

By James Shaw
BBC News, Baghdad






An attack by a US helicopter against suspected insurgents in Iraq has killed
a number of children at a primary school, Iraqi security sources say.

The attack took place in Diyala province north-east of Baghdad, the sources
say.

A spokesman for the US military said there had been helicopter activity in
the area but he was not able to confirm any other details.

The school is in the village of al-Nedawat close to the Iranian border.

Investigation

One police officer said the helicopter was shot at from the ground during
the morning.

The school was said to have been hit when the aircraft returned fire.

The officer said police had spoken to eyewitnesses and that six children had
been killed and six injured but the figures have not been independently
confirmed.



US troops on Iraq murder charges

The US military in Iraq has charged two of its soldiers with the murder of
three Iraqis between April and June in the Iskandariya area, south of
Baghdad.

Both of the men are accused of premeditated murder and placing weapons
beside the bodies of the dead, who were killed in three separate incidents.

Staff Sergeant Michael A Hensley is accused of three murders and Specialist
Jorge G Sandoval of one.

Charges were brought after fellow soldiers alerted the authorities.


The soldiers are presumed innocent unless and until they are proven
guilty beyond a reasonable doubt of any alleged offense
US statement




Both suspects, who are from the Alaskan-based 25th Infantry Division, are
now being held in US custody in Kuwait. Spc Sandoval was detained while at
home in Texas.

The military statement announcing the charges says the men are "merely an
accusation of wrongdoing".

"The soldiers are presumed innocent unless and until they are proven guilty
beyond a reasonable doubt of any alleged offense," it adds.

Pentagon investigators are already conducting a number of investigations
into incidents of alleged unlawful killings by US forces in Iraq.

In the biggest case, six members of one marine battalion are accused of a
role in the killing of 24 civilians in the town of Haditha, north-west of
Baghdad, in late 2005.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/6256494.stm

Published: 2007/06/30 08:51:02 GMT

© BBC MMVII



US soldier sentenced to 110 years

A US soldier has been sentenced to 110 years in prison for his role in the
rape and murder of a 14-year-old Iraqi girl and the killing of her family.

Private Jesse Spielman was convicted of conspiracy to rape and murder.

He said he acted as a lookout for four other soldiers who carried out the
attack in Mahmudiya in March 2006.

Pfc Spielman was given the longest sentence of the group. Three other
soldiers pleaded guilty and received sentences between five and 100 years.

The fifth man faces trial in a civil court having been discharged from the
army.

'Untrue' allegations

Earlier in the week-long court martial at Fort Campbell in Kentucky, Pfc
Spielman of the 101st Airborne Division admitted arson, conspiracy to
obstruct justice, wrongfully touching a corpse and drinking.

Although prosecutors did not accuse Pfc Spielman of taking part in the rape
or murders, they argued he had participated in the planning of the attack
while drinking whisky and playing cards with the other soldiers.







One of the soldiers convicted of the attack, Sgt Paul Cortez, said that Pfc
Spielman had stood within a few feet of them as they held down Abeer Qassim
al-Janabi and had done nothing to stop them raping her.

The soldiers then killed Miss Janabi, her parents and her younger sister.

But another, Spc James Baker, testified that several portions of a sworn
statement, which he had allowed investigators to draft, had falsely
exaggerated Pfc Spielman's role in the attack.

On Friday evening, the military jury ruled that Pfc Spielman was guilty of
conspiracy to commit rape, rape, housebreaking with intent to commit rape
and four counts of felony murder.

Spc Barker, Sgt Cortez and another soldier, Pf. Bryan L Howard, pleaded
guilty for their roles in the slayings and received sentences of five to 100
years under plea agreements with prosecutors.

The alleged ringleader, former Pvt Steven Green was discharged from the army
for a "personality disorder" before being charged. He faces a possible death
sentence if found guilty by a civil court in Kentucky.

On Friday, a US marine sergeant was found guilty of murdering an Iraqi
civilian in a separate attack, and jailed for 15 years by a court martial in
California.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/6930845.stm

Published: 2007/08/05 00:06:39 GMT

© BBC MMVII

<http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/28/world/middleeast/28sniper.html?_r=1&ref=world&oref=slogin>

An Army sniper is taught to kill people "calmly and deliberately," even when
they pose no immediate danger to him. "A sniper," Army Field Manual 23-10
goes on to state, "must not be susceptible to emotions such as anxiety or
remorse."

But in a crowded military courtroom seemingly stunned into silence on
Thursday, Sgt. Evan Vela all but broke down as he described firing two
bullets into an unarmed Iraqi man his unit arrested last May.

In anguished, eloquent sentences, Sergeant Vela, a member of an elite sniper
scout platoon with the First Battalion, 501st Infantry Regiment, quietly
described how his squad leader, Staff Sgt. Michael A. Hensley, cut off the
man's handcuffs, wrestled him to his feet and ordered Sergeant Vela,
standing a few feet away, to fire the 9-millimeter service pistol into the
detainee's head.

"I heard the word 'Shoot,'" Sergeant Vela recalled. "I don't remember
pulling the trigger," he said. "I just came through and the guy was dead,
and it just took me a second to realize the shot had come from the pistol."

Then, Sergeant Vela said, as the man, a suspected insurgent, convulsed on
the ground, Sergeant Hensley kicked him in the throat and told Sergeant Vela
to shoot him again. Sergeant Vela, who is not on trial but faces murder
charges in connection with the killing, said he fired a second time.

His testimony on Thursday, in the court-martial of Specialist Jorge G.
Sandoval Jr., another sniper who is accused of murder, provided a glimpse
into the dark moments of a platoon exhausted, emotionally and physically, by
days-long missions in the region south of Baghdad that soldiers call the
"triangle of death." In their testimony, Sergeant Vela and other soldiers
described how their teams were pushed beyond limits by battalion commanders
eager to raise their kill ratio against a ruthless enemy.

During a separate hearing here in July, Sgt. Anthony G. Murphy said he and
other First Battalion snipers felt "an underlying tone" of disappointment
from field commanders seeking higher enemy body counts.

"It just kind of felt like, 'What are you guys doing wrong out there?'" he
said at the time.

That attitude among superiors changed earlier this year after Sergeant
Hensley, an expert marksman, became a team leader, according to soldiers'
testimony. Though sometimes unorthodox, soldiers said, Sergeant Hensley and
other snipers around him began racking up many more kills, pleasing the
commanders.

Soldiers also testified that battalion commanders authorized a classified
new technique that used fake explosives and detonation wires as "bait" to
lure and kill suspected insurgents around Iskandariya, a hostile Sunni Arab
region south of Baghdad.

As their superiors sought less restrictive rules of engagement - to legalize
the combat killing of anyone who made a soldier "feel threatened," for
example, instead of showing hostile intent or actions - the baiting program,
as it was known, succeeded in killing more Iraqis suspected of being
terrorists, soldiers testified.

But testimony in proceedings for Sergeant Hensley and, on Thursday, for
Specialist Sandoval, both of whom face murder charges in connection with
separate killings of Iraqi men last spring, suggest that as the integrity of
the battalion's secret baiting program began to crack, so did Sergeant
Hensley.

Only a select group of snipers in the battalion were told of the program,
but many more were ordered, without explanation, to carry the baiting items
on missions, creating rumors that the items were intended to be planted on
victims of unjustified killings, soldiers testified.

Sergeant Hensley, according to several snipers, added to such suspicions
when he told a junior member of his team to plant a roll of copper wire -
clear contraband - on a suspected insurgent that Specialist Sandoval killed
on April 27 after being authorized to shoot by his platoon commander.

(...)
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8SAE9G00&show_article=1
WASHINGTON (AP) - A U.S. Patriot missile was accidentally fired from a
military base in Qatar, hitting a nearby farm, the Pentagon said Tuesday.
Defense Department spokesman Bryan Whitman said the missile landed in an
"unpopulated farm area" and no one was injured.
The incident-which occurred Monday night in Washington time, Tuesday in
Qatar-is being investigated, Whitman said.
"It's been described as an accidental discharge; beyond that it's just not
clear at this time" what happened, Whitman said.
The official Qatar News Agency, quoting an unnamed official with Qatar
Armed
Forces General Command, said the missile was erroneously fired from Camp
As
Sayliyah, located on the outskirts of Doha and caused no damage.
Ø CAPTAIN OF NUCLEAR SUBMARINE SACKED FOR DANGEROUS INCOMPETANCE
Commander Michael Portland Captain of the USS Hampton has been sacked
from
his post as captain for failing to carry out daily safety checks on his
nuclear reactor and weapons systems. He even went so far as to falsify
safety records. The negligence could have caused an explosion aboard the
submarine according to defence dept officials, the events happened while
the
vessel was docked in San Diego. This come after a major blunder in
september
when the USAF had to discipline SEVENTY airmen after they LOST 6 Nuclear
weapons.
Serious questions are now being asked about the competance of the officers
in charge of the worlds mightiest nuclear arsenal.
Shit I have being saying it for years, the yanks are definately the most
poweful military in the world but they are also the most useless' inept,
and
incompetant military in history.
Record numbers of US troops deserting

Ø http://apnews.myway.com/article/20071116/D8SV1IUO1.html
WASHINGTON (AP) - Soldiers strained by six years at war are deserting
their posts at the highest rate since 1980, with the number of Army
deserters this year showing an 80 percent increase since the United
States invaded Iraq in 2003.
While the totals are still far lower than they were during the Vietnam
War, when the draft was in effect, they show a steady increase over
the past four years and a 42 percent jump since last year.
(...)
Ø US forces were caught red-handed ...
secretly IMPORTING at least 2,300 banned chemical
weapons (WMDs) into Iraq.
Any guesses where they plan to use them?
"US VIOLATES CHEMICAL WEAPONS CONVENTION"
http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/cgi-bin/blogs/voices.php/2007/11/09/p20919
[
The United States has been caught with at least 2,386 chemical weapons
deployed
in Iraq. The items appear in a spectacular 2,000 page leak of nearly one
million
items of US military equipment deployed in Iraq given to the government
transparency group Wikileaks. The items are labeled under the military's
own
NATO supply classification Chemical weapons and equipment.
]
http://wikileaks.org/wiki/US_violates_chemical_weapons_convention
Ø The unauthorized Aug. 29/30 cross-country flight of a B-52H
Stratofortress armed with six nuclear-tipped AGM-29 Advanced Cruise
missiles, which saw these 150-kiloton warheads go missing for 36
hours, has all the elements of two Hollywood movies. One would be
a thriller about the theft from an armed weapons bunker of six nukes
for some dark and murky purpose.

Marine avoids Iraq murder charge The alleged leader of US troops who killed
24 unarmed Iraqi civilians in 2005 in Haditha will not face murder charges,
a US Marines spokesman said.

Sgt Frank Wuterich, 27, will stand trial for voluntary manslaughter,
aggravated assault, dereliction of duty and other charges, officials said.

The decision was made by Lt Gen Samuel Helland, who is overseeing the case.

Sgt Wuterich is the last of four marines to have the murder charge against
him dropped.

Another marine, 1st Lt Andrew Grayson, was ordered to face court-martial for
making false official statements and other charges.

'Insurgent gunfight'

Twenty-four Iraqi civilians, including three women, seven children and
several elderly men, died at Haditha, in Anbar province, on 19 November
2005.

Iraqi witnesses say the shootings were in retaliation for a roadside bomb
that killed one of the marines, Lance Cpl Miguel Terrazas, as his convoy
drove through the town.

The US military at first reported that the Iraqis had been killed by an
improvised explosive device (IED) that killed L/Cpl Terrazas, or in a
subsequent gunfight with insurgents.

But Iraqi witnesses said the US troops shot dead five unarmed men in a car
when they approached the scene of the bombing in a taxi.

They were then accused of killing 19 other civilians in three houses nearby
over the next few hours.

Despite the accusations, there was no full US investigation into what
happened until January 2006, when video footage emerged of the aftermath,
shot by a local human rights activist.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/7166381.stm

Published: 2007/12/31 19:08:27 GMT

© BBC MMVIII

Police 'Find Remains Of Missing Marine'
Updated:10:34, Saturday January 12, 2008

Police investigating the disappearance of a pregnant US marine believe they
have found her burnt remains at the home of a colleague she had accused of
rape.
The remains, said to be of Lance Corporal Maria Lauterbach, were discovered
in a shallow grave in the garden of Marine Corporal Cesar Laurean.


Maria Lauterbach was pregnant

Police are now searching for the suspect who has fled the area.

Authorities in Jacksonville, North Carolina, also said there was evidence
inside the house that suggested that she had been killed and are treating
the case as murder.

But the suspect allegedly left a note insisting that she had taken her own
life.

The note said Lauterbach had "come to his residence and cut her (own)
throat," according to police.

Lauren wrote that he had nothing to do with Lauterbach's suicide, but he had
buried her body in Camp Lejeune.

However, crime scene investigators have found bloodstains and signs that a
cleanup had taken place inside the home, Onslow County Sheriff Ed Brown
said.



Suspect: Cesar Laurean

Lance Cpl Lauterbach, 20, vanished three weeks ago, just days after she
talked to military prosecutors about a rape case against Laurean, who
remains at large.

The search is continuing for the 21-year-old from Clark County, Nevada, who
had refused to meet investigators and apparently left the area without
telling his lawyers where he was going.

Speaking outside the family's home in Vandalia, Ohio, Lauterbach's uncle,
Pete Steiner, said: "She was raped. The Marines, unfortunately, did not
protect her, and now she's dead."


















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end
soup
2008-01-18 10:12:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry
http://members.tripod.com/mise_eire/RunAway.html
Life imitates Monty Python - British army says, "Run Away!!!!!"
The Army is not a police force.
You would be the first to object if they had reacted in the way they are
(mostly)trained and shot the protestors. So deserted base (no threat to
life or property) officer in charge decides it will be better that the
Police deal, and you say(imply) this is a bad thing.

c.f. Bloody Sunday(1972) where the Army (airborne) where used as a
police force.
--
www.cheesesoup.myby.co.uk
Terryc
2008-01-17 14:08:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ralph
If it weren't for the Yanks you'd be speaking German right about now,
and a lot more politely.
lol, if it wasn't for the Russians. The yanks came to the party after
all the hard work had already been done in both spheres.
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-17 14:21:28 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 18 Jan 2008 01:08:49 +1100, Terryc
Post by Terryc
Post by Ralph
If it weren't for the Yanks you'd be speaking German right about now,
and a lot more politely.
lol, if it wasn't for the Russians. The yanks came to the party after
all the hard work had already been done in both spheres.
Hardly. The Nips OWNED the Philippines until the US arrived under
General McArthur. What have you been reading?

Lg
The Rifleman
2008-01-17 15:49:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Hardly. The Nips OWNED the Philippines until the US arrived under
General McArthur. What have you been reading?
Lg
Hardly the yanks had the Philipines and Mc arthur promised not to run, The
japs easily drove out the yanks leaving only the Aussuies with small
detachments out there. Macarther did not arrive, he crawled back after being
chased out in the first place.
Lawrence Glickman
2008-01-17 18:38:45 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:49:20 -0000, "The Rifleman"
Post by The Rifleman
Post by Lawrence Glickman
Hardly. The Nips OWNED the Philippines until the US arrived under
General McArthur. What have you been reading?
Lg
Hardly the yanks had the Philipines and Mc arthur promised not to run, The
japs easily drove out the yanks leaving only the Aussuies with small
detachments out there. Macarther did not arrive, he crawled back after being
chased out in the first place.
I admit that McArthur was a sniveling pig fucker, and should have been
assassinated/executed for High Treason for abandoning his troops in
the face of the enemy.

Otoh, the Philippines were SWARMING with Japs, and even after a week
of Naval and aerial bombardment on Iwo Jima, STILL presented machine
gun fire and mortar fire to the troops coming on to the beach. You
need to throw away your *new and revised* version of what happened,
and go to the War Library at your local military base to get the real
skinny.

It's all on Dept of Defense film for your viewing pleasure.

Lg
The Rifleman
2008-01-19 15:24:31 UTC
Permalink
.
Post by Lawrence Glickman
I admit that McArthur was a sniveling pig fucker, and should have been
assassinated/executed for High Treason for abandoning his troops in
the face of the enemy.
Otoh, the Philippines were SWARMING with Japs, and even after a week
of Naval and aerial bombardment on Iwo Jima, STILL presented machine
gun fire and mortar fire to the troops coming on to the beach. You
need to throw away your *new and revised* version of what happened,
and go to the War Library at your local military base to get the real
skinny.
It's all on Dept of Defense film for your viewing pleasure.
Lg
Naa its just another stunning US loss.
Gunner
2008-01-17 16:15:21 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 18 Jan 2008 01:08:49 +1100, Terryc
Post by Terryc
Post by Ralph
If it weren't for the Yanks you'd be speaking German right about now,
and a lot more politely.
lol, if it wasn't for the Russians. The yanks came to the party after
all the hard work had already been done in both spheres.
Without the US..the Brits and the Russians would have starved to
death, sitting in ox carts.

Gunner
Ralph
2008-01-17 19:27:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Terryc
Post by Ralph
If it weren't for the Yanks you'd be speaking German right about now,
and a lot more politely.
lol, if it wasn't for the Russians. The yanks came to the party after
all the hard work had already been done in both spheres.
Germany spent about half it's production on U-boat production and air
power which was primarly used against the west wiich includes the Yanks,
so i'd give them some credit.
Stormin Mormon
2008-01-20 06:01:45 UTC
Permalink
With pinwheels sewn to your upper arm.
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.


"Ralph" <***@noway.net> wrote in message news:1iatnfd.ez4c1l1p5pzy8N%***@noway.net...
If it weren't for the Yanks you'd be speaking German right about now,
and a lot more politely.
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